I hope work from home continues • Hacker News Board

Re: I hope work from home continues

#231

Post by heyitsguay » Tue, Apr 06, 2021, 3:59 PM UTC

spurdoman77 wrote: post #201

protonimitate wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a hard time wrapping my head around why companies are mandating 100% return to office. Cost issues aside, I've always maintained that the absolute best experience is a hybrid/flexible schedule and location policy. I'm currently full time remote (I'm on the East Coast working for a West Coast company). My previous company had its main office in my current city, but allowed a super flexible choose-where-you-work…

Trust issues. While 80% of employees could be more productive remote, 18% could have serious issues with productivity and 2% might actually turn nefarious while remote (steal company IPR or something like that). Or I would imagine thats what the fear is.

Isn't this a process failure? At least for that hypothetical 18%. If you have a product roadmap with well-defined milestones and good weekly accountability, it should be clear very quickly if someone is underperforming. There may be people who don't want to work remotely, but that's again why having a flexible+hybrid WFH approach seems like the best of all worlds.

Re: I hope work from home continues

#232

Post by lotsofpulp » Tue, Apr 06, 2021, 3:59 PM UTC

enriquec wrote: post #204

duckfang wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can’t choose to not care. It's all a matter of priorities. If caring means you lose your job, yeah, you're not gonna care. And losing your job in the USA means: hunger, homelessness, no internet, less chance of being hired with unemployment record, assumption that you did something terrible, low/no medical, etc. For many, especially those whom can't save a nest egg of appreciable value (6 months out of work kin…

Total, complete nonsense and lies. We have unemployment here - paid by the employer - and its substantial. I know several people who are even able to increase their savings while unemployed.

In the US, employers pay unemployment insurance premiums to the state. The state then pays unemployment benefits to qualifying individuals. Individuals who resign (quit) or are terminated for cause are not eligible for unemployment benefits.

For example, an employer can slowly ratchet up requirements at work to the point where they can document an employee is not performing, terminate them, and the employee is not eligible for unemployment benefits. (This benefits the employer by keeping their unemployment insurance premiums low).

Also, unemployment benefit amounts vary greatly by state. They are a pittance in the vast majority of the states, especially if you consider most people don't have the cheapest possible lease/mortgage, and they can't just move out of where they live the week after they are terminated.

https://savingtoinvest.com/maximum-weekly-unemployment-benef...

There was a temporary supplement of unemployment benefits by the federal government due to COVID, but that is exceptional, and those are gone now.

Also, the process is the punishment. You should talk to people who had issues or who aren't proficient with the online applications how much of a pain it is to resolve issues with unemployment benefits over the past year. You have to call the minute the office opens up in the morning, and if you don't get in the hold queue immediately, you are told to call again the next day by the automated message. I know for a fact that this is still happening today, a year+ since COVID started.

Edit: I just tried Washington state's unemployment phone call line (open 8AM to 4PM). It's 9:07AM, and after 2m20s of various prompts on the phone, you are informed that "All agents are currently busy, call back at a later time". So imagine you have kids to take care of, jobs to look for, and you have to spend your time repeatedly calling the phone number, wait 2m20s each time to be told to call later. Your only chance is really to call at 7:59AM and hope you get through to the hold queue. If not, then your benefits are delayed one more day and you try the next day. As an American, it's embarrassing to me.

Re: I hope work from home continues

#233

Post by throwawayboise » Tue, Apr 06, 2021, 3:59 PM UTC

pizza234 wrote: post #225

HWR_14 wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm thrown by people working on a laptop. Do you have a battery powered second screen? Is there some workflow tips I should adopt to make it work better? I'm quite jealous of people who can work on laptops. I wonder the degree to which people enjoy WFH is the same as the degree to which they enjoy working on a laptop. Even the people I know with a dedicated room for work set up want to go back to the office if they p…

I have a minimalist approach to interfaces, and work on 1080p (both desktop and laptop). I don't have second monitors and I don't intend to add any. I don't doubt that adding screen estate has value, but in the minimalistic spirit, anything added also subtracts something :) And in the same spirit, anything subtracted adds something else - in my case, the ability to work more efficiently. Try to work on a single scree…

I use a window manager that has multiple desktops. It's like having 9 screens, only you can only see one of them at a time. But really, that's how screens are. You can't really look at two screens at once.

Re: I hope work from home continues

#234

Post by fiftyfifty » Tue, Apr 06, 2021, 3:59 PM UTC

protonimitate wrote: post #143

blunte wrote: post #64

Wow, the author has a pretty miserable company :(. That said, I share most of the opinions even though I quite like the office environment of my company. I abso-fking-love choosing where I work (and to some degree, when). Being able to take my laptop and go sit under a canopy in my back yard when the weather is nice, seeing my rabbits hopping around the yard, my cats avoiding the aggressive she-rabbit, hearing the bi…

I have a hard time wrapping my head around why companies are mandating 100% return to office. Cost issues aside, I've always maintained that the absolute best experience is a hybrid/flexible schedule and location policy. I'm currently full time remote (I'm on the East Coast working for a West Coast company). My previous company had its main office in my current city, but allowed a super flexible choose-where-you-work…

The company I work for actually suggested getting rid of our office and going 100% remote for our group. We actually voted on whether to keep leasing it after Covid or not. We voted to keep it as we generally like our office and it's nice to have a place to meet face to face sometimes. Since we voted to keep it corporate has told us we have to come in at least 3 days a week after Covid. So for us it's less an issue of trust and more an issue of we are paying for this place so you better use it.

Re: I hope work from home continues

#235

Post by grep_name » Tue, Apr 06, 2021, 3:59 PM UTC

jmkni wrote: post #23

I’m completely the opposite to be honest. I’ve found working from home lonely and isolating, and am badly missing the structure of getting up, showered and going into an office! For people at a certain stage of life, I’m sure working from home is great, but have some empathy for those of us it sucks for.

> For people at a certain stage of life

Nobody seems to discuss this, but yeah for me working from home means working from my bedroom, the only room I can really work in in my small shared apartment. It definitely affects my productivity.

On the other hand, I've basically stopped getting sick. Open office plans are very bad for certain types of people, and not just those who struggle with distraction, so still a net positive for me

Re: I hope work from home continues

#236

Post by ghaff » Tue, Apr 06, 2021, 3:59 PM UTC

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #185

blunte wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my remote experience, I definitely don't talk to my colleagues that much. But when you're trying to build a small company, one approach is to make it feel like a family. And families always have people we like and people we like not so much. But there's something special about one unit working toward a single goal. My design is for a startup with young people. This would not work nearly as well for older people an…

I managed distributed teams long before COVID. Having people meet in person a few times a year does wonders for team cohesion. Some people handle remote communications just fine. Others were raised on a steady diet of internet flame wars and approach the screen names in their company chat the same way: As enemies to argue with every day. Putting people in front of each other associates a real person with that screen…

Yeah. Remote is fine but you need to budget time and money for plane tickets and hotels. That's been the tough thing for me the past year. I'm normally remote although I could go into an office--and am technically assigned to one but I normally travel to a lot of events as well as off-sites.

>Face to face meetings need to happen on regular company time as much as possible.

Yep. I sometimes hear people talking about how we should have team building events on the weekend. That's a big nope. In fact, while it's sometimes unavoidable, I sort of resent it when I need to travel on a Sunday to get to some event/meeting.

Re: I hope work from home continues

#237

Post by csa » Tue, Apr 06, 2021, 4:00 PM UTC

folkrav wrote: post #151

blunte wrote: post #64

Wow, the author has a pretty miserable company :(. That said, I share most of the opinions even though I quite like the office environment of my company. I abso-fking-love choosing where I work (and to some degree, when). Being able to take my laptop and go sit under a canopy in my back yard when the weather is nice, seeing my rabbits hopping around the yard, my cats avoiding the aggressive she-rabbit, hearing the bi…

> And for the social aspect, weekend or week-long dev retreats are ideal. As much as I appreciate (most of) my coworkers, on nights and weekends I want to close my computer and spend quality time with my family, not see and talk to the same people I am already forced to talk to 35-40h a week. They might be ideal to you, but you're assuming quite a lot about everyone's situations if you think they work for everyone.

GP post was referring to retreats for 100% remote workers, which would be work with a f2f element rather than merely socializing during your free time.

These could happen during the week or (depending on the retreat) the weekend, with weekends probably being given comp time in lieu.

If you think that a modicum of face time throughout the year for a remote team has no value to a group or team, I’ve got news for you.

If you think GP was referring to additional face time in addition to face time at a workplace, then I think you may be projecting and selective quoting a bit. Note that employees at this small company can work when and where they want.

Re: I hope work from home continues

#238

Post by ThrowawayR2 » Tue, Apr 06, 2021, 4:00 PM UTC

techsupporter wrote: post #125

bigcorp-slave wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you live in Silicon Valley? Nice homes cannot be chosen close to work. All homes in the South Bay that aren’t literally falling down are multi-million-dollar. I personally know people who bought a $2.5m home with a rat infestation.

> Do you live in Silicon Valley? Nice homes cannot be chosen close to work. And in large parts of the rest of the country, it's illegal to put homes close to work. Where I work is on the edge of an office campus on the edge of a suburb of Seattle. By city ordinance, virtually no housing is allowed anywhere near where I work. If you live in the same municipality as this office and work at it, your only choice to get t…

> "By city ordinance, virtually no housing is allowed anywhere near where I work."

Must be specific to your suburb. I can look out the window of my downtown Seattle office straight into the windows of the condo complex across the street. As for the suburbs, having passed by innumerable times, the north edge of Microsoft's main campus is directly across the street from apartments and rowhomes.

Re: I hope work from home continues

#239

Post by dv_dt » Tue, Apr 06, 2021, 4:00 PM UTC

spurdoman77 wrote: post #201

protonimitate wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a hard time wrapping my head around why companies are mandating 100% return to office. Cost issues aside, I've always maintained that the absolute best experience is a hybrid/flexible schedule and location policy. I'm currently full time remote (I'm on the East Coast working for a West Coast company). My previous company had its main office in my current city, but allowed a super flexible choose-where-you-work…

Trust issues. While 80% of employees could be more productive remote, 18% could have serious issues with productivity and 2% might actually turn nefarious while remote (steal company IPR or something like that). Or I would imagine thats what the fear is.

The numbers are probably close to the same in office too, only the 2% (or whatever percentage it is), ends up with more access to physical capital to steal in office.

Personally, I hope the future for work becomes as remote as possible as near to a 4 day week as possible.

Re: I hope work from home continues

#240

Post by blunte » Tue, Apr 06, 2021, 4:01 PM UTC

ramphastidae wrote: post #194

blunte wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my remote experience, I definitely don't talk to my colleagues that much. But when you're trying to build a small company, one approach is to make it feel like a family. And families always have people we like and people we like not so much. But there's something special about one unit working toward a single goal. My design is for a startup with young people. This would not work nearly as well for older people an…

So, to be clear, your plan is no different than all the other crappy companies people complain about: replace real process and professional management with calling yourself a family, “perks” the employees already pay for through reduced salary like food, and taking advantage of young, cheap labor that doesn’t know any better than to be exploited?

Is that what you read? No, I am creating the kind of company I would have loved to work for.

Salary is fine, but I know firsthand that if there is good free food, I will stay and work through lunch (or at least talk with my colleagues about work challenges while eating the nice food).

Look, if someone is not happy with their work, free food or free trips is only going to hold them in place for a short while. They absolutely will leave at some point, and chances are they'll either do some damage on the way out or take some IP if possible. If you don't treat people well, you get what you deserve.