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Redefining what a map can be with new information and AI

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Re: Redefining what a map can be with new information and AI

#151

Post by lovemenot »

lovemenot wrote: post #124
arsome wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What percentage of the limited time in your life is worth what level of impact on climate change? Do something much more likely to be useful: implement a reasonable, even revenue-neutral carbon tax and stop with this non-sense.

This is complex and will vary significantly by person. But for anyone the answer is almost certainly non-zero. Even if only marginally. And the trend seems to be increasing. The second part of your comment, seems to assume only one kind of action is possible. Others might say, great let's do both.

I cannot respond to throwawayboise directly because of thread limitations.

On its face, this argument is clearly wrong. "Absolutely nothing", is not equivalent to extremely little. Especially when, as in the case of Google Maps, there is a large multiplier.

Elections are a different beast. Assuming first-past-the-post system where impact is only at the margin (50.0001%).

Whereas direct action on CO2 production is incremental. We can argue it's not enough, but we cannot argue it is literally nothing.

Re: Redefining what a map can be with new information and AI

#152

Post by seoaeu »

fireeyed wrote: post #140

What happens if these “lowest carbon footprint” routes overlaps with high crime “waze avoid areas” ? Which takes precedence, Virtue signaling or driver safety? https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10708-019-10117-y

Taking an alternate route to avoid CO2 emissions is basically the opposite of virtue signaling: it actually has a real world impact, and doesn't "signal" to anybody because no one else on the road can even tell whether you're taking the low-carbon route or not.

Re: Redefining what a map can be with new information and AI

#153

Post by aaron695 »

> Google Maps will soon default to the route with the lowest carbon footprint

This is not the title of the blog. And that matters because this doesn't make sense.

The fastest route should be the lowest carbon footprint, which it should currently default too.

"road incline and traffic congestion"

I find it unlikely road incline makes 'any' significant percentage difference. I'd want to see the mathematics on this. Adding this complexity seems like PR BS.

'Traffic congestion' might make a difference, sitting still in traffic might be better than going around. Not good for your mental health though.

How about better directions so we make less wrong turns and also save on CO2 emissions. How about better predictions on congestion. A better product will do both.

Re: Redefining what a map can be with new information and AI

#154

Post by ape4 »

atty wrote: post #77
oceliker wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If I could, I'd usually choose the lowest stress route! Apple Maps sometimes features alternate routes that are "simpler" or with "fewer turns", which I think is a very nice feature. I'd rather not cut through small side streets just to save 1-2 minutes.

I almost always take the simpler route, especially in areas I’m not familiar with. It’s a very nice quality of life feature that doesn’t get mentioned much.

I'd love a simpler route choice in Google Maps. It very telling that they don't provide it - do they use their own product.

Re: Redefining what a map can be with new information and AI

#155

Post by pimlottc »

throwawayboise wrote: post #131

FTA but not the main point of this thread: we’re now able to bring Live View to some of the trickiest-to-navigate places indoors: airports, transit stations and malls. Seems to me that these are the easiest places to navigate indoors, because of the plentiful signage. Malls probably the hardest of the three, but still pretty easy IMO. I've never had any issue finding a gate or baggage claim at an airport, since there…

Depends on what you’re looking for. Finding the approved ride share pickup spot can be pretty tricky in some airports. It can also be hard to identify and communicate exactly where you are on the curb (where’s “gate 6”?).

Re: Redefining what a map can be with new information and AI

#156

Post by TulliusCicero »

throwawayboise wrote: post #131

FTA but not the main point of this thread: we’re now able to bring Live View to some of the trickiest-to-navigate places indoors: airports, transit stations and malls. Seems to me that these are the easiest places to navigate indoors, because of the plentiful signage. Malls probably the hardest of the three, but still pretty easy IMO. I've never had any issue finding a gate or baggage claim at an airport, since there…

Underground transit stations can be a huge pain in the ass to find the right exit for, when you want to come out going a particular direction, because you have no sense of cardinal directions while underground.

Re: Redefining what a map can be with new information and AI

#158

Post by TulliusCicero »

jeffbee wrote: post #125
thescriptkiddie wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A pet peeve of mine is that google maps doesn't show most transit routes on the map. There is a transit layer you can enable, but it only shows metro and light rail, not buses, brt, trams, ferries, etc.

This is a problem with GTFS. Firstly, that GTFS has separate enumerators for trains vs. buses, and only shows stuff that identifies itself as trains, but also because most agencies do not provide route shapes that are good enough to display. Often the routes run right down the centerlines of roads, cut through buildings at corners, etc. There would have to be a revolution in local government agency GIS quality contro…

I feel like Google itself could probably clean up the route presentation, given their own understanding of the roads.

Re: Redefining what a map can be with new information and AI

#159

Post by jhugo »

pimlottc wrote: post #155
throwawayboise wrote: post #131

FTA but not the main point of this thread: we’re now able to bring Live View to some of the trickiest-to-navigate places indoors: airports, transit stations and malls. Seems to me that these are the easiest places to navigate indoors, because of the plentiful signage. Malls probably the hardest of the three, but still pretty easy IMO. I've never had any issue finding a gate or baggage claim at an airport, since there…

Depends on what you’re looking for. Finding the approved ride share pickup spot can be pretty tricky in some airports. It can also be hard to identify and communicate exactly where you are on the curb (where’s “gate 6”?).

> Finding the approved ride share pickup spot can be pretty tricky in some airports.

This may be by design - the local taxi mafia usually gets the front door and then the rideshare pickup is somewhere out of the way with bad signage.

Re: Redefining what a map can be with new information and AI

#160

Post by jeffbee »

TulliusCicero wrote: post #158
jeffbee wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a problem with GTFS. Firstly, that GTFS has separate enumerators for trains vs. buses, and only shows stuff that identifies itself as trains, but also because most agencies do not provide route shapes that are good enough to display. Often the routes run right down the centerlines of roads, cut through buildings at corners, etc. There would have to be a revolution in local government agency GIS quality contro…

I feel like Google itself could probably clean up the route presentation, given their own understanding of the roads.

Technically it sounds feasible, but they'd want to avoid being accused of undermining the open data of the GTFS ecosystem.
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