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Hit songwriters ask pop stars to stop taking credit for songs they didn't write

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Hit songwriters ask pop stars to stop taking credit for songs they didn't write

#241

Post by pests »

kmeisthax wrote: post #223
Varriount wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps it's naive of me, but I can't help but look down on this kind of behavior. I know that tax money is rarely spent in the most efficient way possible, but (ideally) the point of taxes is that they go to benefit the general public. Moving just so one doesn't have to pay as much, after (presumably) living in the state for some time feels selfish and greedy.

Some states actually have laws specifically to prevent this. For example, if you work remote for a company based in NY, PA, CT, DE, AR, or NE; your income is taxable in that state regardless of where you live or work. This is known as a "convenience of the employer" test. In fact, before a certain SCOTUS ruling you couldn't even claim a refund on that tax for your residence state's tax return (and even after, that re…

In the case of Americans outside the US... You can write off foreign taxes paid up to a limit on the American side.

Re: Hit songwriters ask pop stars to stop taking credit for songs they didn't write

#242

Post by jfengel »

offtop5 wrote: post #226
throwaway1777 wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a few friends in the business and they are basically all broke except for one. Music is like the game industry. Hits based and there are far more talented people pursuing it than there are hits. Being talented isn’t enough, you need to be well connected, good looking, lucky, etc. The internet has made it better than ever to carve out a niche and get a few thousand fans, but it’s still hard to get people to cho…

The music industry is much worse in my opinion. If you spend half your life learning to program so you can make games, you can always give up at 38 and start working on boring enterprise software. If You're a 38-year-old self-taught musician you can't exactly walk into a company and get a job. I still make music as one of my main hobbies, but I've accepted that no one will ever know who I am, and I'll never make a si…

That is precisely the story of a close friend. It really messed her up for several years. She was genuinely amazingly talented but her band never managed to be in the right place at the right time.

She did land on her feet, after literally going all the way back to college as a freshman. (She was fortunate to have the resources for that.)

Best anecdote though, on the 18 year olds who she befriended in the program: "The good news is they think I'm 28. The bad news is they think that's old."

Re: Hit songwriters ask pop stars to stop taking credit for songs they didn't write

#243

Post by taeric »

Johnny555 wrote: post #189
rgifford wrote: post #175

A friend of mine decided to pursue music production around the same time I started in software engineering. We're both 20 somethings. We swap war stories now and then. I get to hear about how he's working with his mentor to do vocal production on a track getting pitched for Maroon 5, The Chainsmokers, etc. Sometimes the tracks take -- the artist likes them and decides to move forward. Usually they don't and it's a lo…

He moved to WA to dodge CA income tax If he waited for the big check before he made that move, CA will find him - it's not where you live when you got the check, it's where you live when you earned it.

If it is royalties coming in, things have to get complicated. They could have seen that it was going to be good, and then moved.

In which case... I am genuinely curious what the legal rules are.

Re: Hit songwriters ask pop stars to stop taking credit for songs they didn't write

#244

Post by saurik »

rgifford wrote: post #175

A friend of mine decided to pursue music production around the same time I started in software engineering. We're both 20 somethings. We swap war stories now and then. I get to hear about how he's working with his mentor to do vocal production on a track getting pitched for Maroon 5, The Chainsmokers, etc. Sometimes the tracks take -- the artist likes them and decides to move forward. Usually they don't and it's a lo…

> My friend's mentor is late 30s and mainly does songwriting. ... He went from "how do I pay rent" to 7M literally over night.

> The people who make the most look good, sound good, and hell they're crazy talented. But they aren't the people who've written the lyrics or the melodies that define our culture.

I am confused by the story: isn't the person who made the big bucks here a person who "mainly does songwriting"?

Re: Hit songwriters ask pop stars to stop taking credit for songs they didn't write

#245

Post by ljf »

kbenson wrote: post #232
kmeisthax wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some states actually have laws specifically to prevent this. For example, if you work remote for a company based in NY, PA, CT, DE, AR, or NE; your income is taxable in that state regardless of where you live or work. This is known as a "convenience of the employer" test. In fact, before a certain SCOTUS ruling you couldn't even claim a refund on that tax for your residence state's tax return (and even after, that re…

> Emigrate from the US and you'll still be expected to pay US taxes on foreign income. That's because you still have U.S. citizenship. You can give that up and not be taxed, as I understand it. Also, it looks like there are provisions to give you exclusions on your foreign income,if you have any.[1] That seems sane to me, if you live their the whole year and that location is your tax base, then you can exclude all th…

As a Brit, I can work wherever I can find work (and legally work) around the world, earn a fortune and not pay any tax in the UK, /and/ keep my citizenship. I only would pay tax to the UK on income I earn here (which in itself leads to all kinds of strange and dodgy scenarios in terms of people avoiding paying taxes here)

Re: Hit songwriters ask pop stars to stop taking credit for songs they didn't write

#246

Post by exactlysolved »

Rule35 wrote: post #230
exactlysolved wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Not no evidence except the word of the person denying a story which paints them in a bad light. If true, it is very surprising. Surely in most venues the people responsible for back stage hospitality are not the same people responsible for lighting, electrics, sound installation and stage safety? Isn't it quite likely that one of those teams would have met the requ…

Your assertion that they were dicks is funny. Even if they just didn't like brown M&Ms if they were paying for the venue then surely it was no different than expecting their personal luggage to be carried to the dressing room, or having banners hung. Why is this request so egregious that it's dickish but having the right brand of sparkling water is not? > Surely in most venues the people responsible for back stage ho…

The original story has been told for around 50 years with the widely noted implication "this was dickish behavior - they didn't have any particular preference for non-brown M&Ms but just wanted to mess with the people waiting on them". Even the 'debunkings' invariably recognize this interpretation of the original story.

Obviously part of the reason this story gets told a lot is because a lot of people, many of them management consultants who charge by the day for nuggets of catchy wisdom like this one, love the idea that organizations have a homogenous culture and the same ones that skimp on the buffet preparation also skimp on the rigging safety. Actually, this is complete fantasy. It's perfectly believable to think that the same boss makes sure the artists have everything in their dressing room they want, no matter how demanding, but thinks that they won't check the bigger, critical but more expensive stuff.

Re: Hit songwriters ask pop stars to stop taking credit for songs they didn't write

#247

Post by sorokod »

rgifford wrote: post #175

A friend of mine decided to pursue music production around the same time I started in software engineering. We're both 20 somethings. We swap war stories now and then. I get to hear about how he's working with his mentor to do vocal production on a track getting pitched for Maroon 5, The Chainsmokers, etc. Sometimes the tracks take -- the artist likes them and decides to move forward. Usually they don't and it's a lo…

In what way are they "crazy talented" if they dont author the lyrics or the music? Is it meant cynically to describe the situation where the performer is just packaging for someone else's talant?

Re: Hit songwriters ask pop stars to stop taking credit for songs they didn't write

#248

Post by compiler-guy »

paublyrne wrote: post #238
compiler-guy wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My macbook pro and a decent USB microphone can produce far more professional demos than the Beatles could produce in 1964. If you listen to, say, the Lost Lennon Tapes, a high-school student can do higher-quality production today, based purely on youtube how-to videos. Sufficient for a pro album ready for radio play? Probably not. But good enough to monetize on youtube? All day long.

There is a lot more to making good quality recordings then having good equipment. There's arrangement, mic placement, room acoustic treatment, mixing and EQ, mastering.

Never said their wasn't. But there can be no doubt that both the equipment and the knowhow is vastly more easy to access today than it was then.

Re: Hit songwriters ask pop stars to stop taking credit for songs they didn't write

#249

Post by shard »

kbenson wrote: post #232
kmeisthax wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some states actually have laws specifically to prevent this. For example, if you work remote for a company based in NY, PA, CT, DE, AR, or NE; your income is taxable in that state regardless of where you live or work. This is known as a "convenience of the employer" test. In fact, before a certain SCOTUS ruling you couldn't even claim a refund on that tax for your residence state's tax return (and even after, that re…

> Emigrate from the US and you'll still be expected to pay US taxes on foreign income. That's because you still have U.S. citizenship. You can give that up and not be taxed, as I understand it. Also, it looks like there are provisions to give you exclusions on your foreign income,if you have any.[1] That seems sane to me, if you live their the whole year and that location is your tax base, then you can exclude all th…

> it looks like there are provisions to give you exclusions on your foreign income,if you have any

The foreign income exclusion is not that high, especially if you are a mid career tech worker ($107,600 for 2020), and you will be double taxed on amounts above the exclusion. But at least you can skip California state taxes if you count as a nonresident.

Re: Hit songwriters ask pop stars to stop taking credit for songs they didn't write

#250

Post by nyczomg »

lostlogin wrote: post #208
oytis wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> since time immoral I like this typo.

Me too - but what would it mean? A long time or a short time?

I assume it means a time length for as long as the times have been immoral.... So perhaps it means since the dawn of mankind?
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