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The political case for a blanket cryptocurrency ban

stephendiehl.com

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Re: The political case for a blanket cryptocurrency ban

#51

Post by api »

slibhb wrote: post #32
_nckn wrote: post #5

I think the main premise of this article is the fact that crypto's carbon emission is insane, especially Bitcoin, which I agree (I don't hold Bitcoin for this exact reason). But there are many other crypto that uses Proof of Stake, way way greener than Proof of Work, such as Cardano. Even Ethereum is transitioning to Proof of Stake. This article should be re-titled "The Political Case for a Blanket Proof of Work Ban"…

The main premise of the article is that cryptocurrencies are "speculation for speculation’s sake," i.e. gambling, and that's bad. Also, the article claims that they contribute to inequality. The green stuff is basically a side note. I don't think it's a terribly strong case but I suppose it depends on whether you agree that crypto is gambling and if you think gambling should banned. Anyway, I think lots of people stu…

Most cryptocurrency activity is speculation, but so is a huge proportion of what happens on Wall St. Are we going to ban hedge funds? What about casinos or even worse state-backed lotteries?

It's the same sort of hypocrisy as deplatforming Parler. While I did not weep for Parler, YouTube and Facebook are the largest platforms for alt-right/fascist propaganda. YouTube's "rabbit hole algorithm" is by far the most powerful engine of indoctrination, and while the most egregious stuff has mostly been kicked off the platform it's still full of "soft pill" fascist/racist material. I am not sure things like Qanon or the alt-right in general would even exist (to such a degree) were it not for YouTube.

A ban or tax on proof of work mining is tempting but it would just offshore that activity. I suppose you could ban PoW cryptocurrencies but there are many alternatives.

This is generally a shitty article.

Re: The political case for a blanket cryptocurrency ban

#52

Post by maigret »

christiansakai wrote: post #43
slibhb wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The main premise of the article is that cryptocurrencies are "speculation for speculation’s sake," i.e. gambling, and that's bad. Also, the article claims that they contribute to inequality. The green stuff is basically a side note. I don't think it's a terribly strong case but I suppose it depends on whether you agree that crypto is gambling and if you think gambling should banned. Anyway, I think lots of people stu…

In conclusion, none of the points addressed in this article hold strong ground.

Until the environmental problem is clearly solved, it still holds strong.

Re: The political case for a blanket cryptocurrency ban

#53

Post by DickingAround »

This article seems to intentionally ignore the core reason for cryptocurrencies; escaping inflation and control. The article then proposes to use the law to bring those people back within the control of fiat and government oversight.

I no longer think the environmental argument is really plausible here. Clearly crypto mining is emitting using a lot of power and some of that is CO2. But the competition is fiat; backed by fighter jets and nukes; literally. How is it that someone can't steal your money? The bank makes sure. How is it the bank can be sure? The cops protect them. How is it the cops aren't overwhelmed? The military protects them. Law and order stands on the backs of a lot of stuff and CO2. Bitcoin is an example of one little piece of this not needing all that stuff. Instead it's protected by this mining fleet. And if you want to contest ownership there's no one to invade, no one to attack; the best you can do is make a fleet and try to mine. It's a small step in the direction of getting away from all these endless wars and control. A little step away from needing to point guns at eachother to protect our pile of stuff. And this author is saying "point guns at them and make them give it up". That's crazy. Just leave them alone.

(If you need to point guns to save the environment, do that specifically. Carbon tax CO2)

Re: The political case for a blanket cryptocurrency ban

#54

Post by svachalek »

purple_ferret wrote: post #44
_nckn wrote: post #5

I think the main premise of this article is the fact that crypto's carbon emission is insane, especially Bitcoin, which I agree (I don't hold Bitcoin for this exact reason). But there are many other crypto that uses Proof of Stake, way way greener than Proof of Work, such as Cardano. Even Ethereum is transitioning to Proof of Stake. This article should be re-titled "The Political Case for a Blanket Proof of Work Ban"…

There are many problems with Proof of Stake (inflation, centralization, etc). Cardano mainnet doesn't even exist yet. Smoke and mirrors.

Inflation and centralization are just as possible on PoW (see Binance Smart Chain) and just as easy to avoid on PoS.

Cardano main net has been around a long time. It just doesn't support smart contracts yet.

Re: The political case for a blanket cryptocurrency ban

#55

Post by namdnay »

rybosworld wrote: post #36

Seems to me that Stephen is not well informed on crypto in general. This article is really only relevant to Bitcoin. Take a project like Brave for instance which is disrupting the online advertising model: https://brave.com/ (I am completely unaffiliated, just a fan of the project) Can you look at this project and tell me with a straight face it is bad for the environment and should be banned by government? Because t…

The thing is, Im not sure Brave really needs a cryptocurrency. It seems that a centralized DB would be enough.

Re: The political case for a blanket cryptocurrency ban

#56

Post by jamal-kumar »

I usually see people who have a lot of disparaging things to say about stuff they clearly have a misunderstanding of as missing out on the fun. Also he doesn't seem to realize that despite lauding Japan's payment infrastructure that SBI Holdings utilizes ripple to make the remittances go fast... they're probably going to end up relocating in that country, leaving the USA even further in the dust

https://www.coindesk.com/japan-xrp-ripple-suit

Re: The political case for a blanket cryptocurrency ban

#57

Post by djschnei »

boringg wrote: post #37

Ban? That silly. How you kill something you don't like is tax it heavily. Add on the carbon tax equivalent to each bitcoin transaction as well as tax the capital gains/losses. Interest will deflate on it's own.

You know capital gains tax already applies to all crypto transactions, right?

Re: The political case for a blanket cryptocurrency ban

#58

Post by tome »

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #14

Let’s go the other way and ban fiat. Money printing is a much greater threat to world security. Print way too much money, run out of resources and room to pump, crash to rock bottom, start a war, then start over again is the historic cycle we are stuck on until we fix this. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debasement https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/M1SL

I don't see anything in the reference that you provide that elaborates on "start a war". Perhaps you could provide the elaboration?

Re: The political case for a blanket cryptocurrency ban

#60

Post by stopBurncoins »

So yesterday in HN we linked to a medium post of mine where I expanded on the problems of Proof of work, and linked to a change.org petition to ban proof of work to force projects move to proof of stake.

It got flagged, but nice to see that somehow the argument itself is not that unapproachable, so I'll link the petition here: https://www.change.org/StopBurncoins

It's full of links on the issue of power, carbon pollution and more.

IMHO the problem is not cryptocoins themselves as is suggested here, but just proof of work

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