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Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

reuters.com

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Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#531

Post by perl4ever »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #514
wizzwizz4 wrote: post #510

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everybody has access to rainwater, except the people who don't. I think the analogy works quite well re point 2 (though not point 3).

We could argue about how fitting it is, but I'll just say this: If we want to go with "everyone has suitable access to rainwater for important household use", then it changes the impact of the water company overcharging. It goes from despicable to mundane.

In the US there are extensive laws about capturing rainwater, whether you can use rain barrels, etc. although it's no longer prohibited in any state.

https://rurallivingtoday.com/homesteading-today/is-it-illega...

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#532

Post by perl4ever »

adrianmonk wrote: post #404
riverageraldo wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This makes me question that shouldn't we have another canal built? Like if so much of the world's economy depends on this route shouldn't we build an extra canal to speed up the transportation and also act as a redundancy

I'm a layman, but it seems like there are probably other preventative measures that are way cheaper. A Bloomberg article ( https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-03-27/how-a-des... ) says the speed limit was 7.6 to 8.6 knots but the Ever Given was traveling at 13.5 knots. So maybe they need to start enforcing that limit. Reportedly this was during high winds, so they could also reduce the speed limit even furth…

>it seems like there are probably other preventative measures that are way cheaper.

Like doing nothing, and sailing around Africa in the extremely rare case there's a problem.

Makes me think of: https://xkcd.com/1205/

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#533

Post by schoen »

perl4ever wrote: post #526
notyourday wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only Qmax and Chinamax are higher.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinamax This has a rather odd diagram, and I'm not sure if it supports your comment or not. It shows Suezmax as having "unlimited length", while Chinamax is given as 360 meters, which I think is smaller than Ever Given. Obviously unlimited length can't be literal, if the Suez isn't perfectly straight, right? On the other hand the Chinamax diagram says "unlimited air draft" which again,…

> Obviously unlimited length can't be literal, if the Suez isn't perfectly straight, right?

It looks to me from the map like the tightest turns in the canal are the southern exit near Suez, and the turns between Timsah Lake and El Qantara el Sharqiya (depending on which channel you're in, and whether you're allowed to use both channels in your turning maneuvers).

It would be a fun problem to find a good way to figure this out exactly, but it looks to me like a ship 3000 to 4000 meters long would not be able to complete those turns even in principle without running aground. (Presumably the actual practical limit is a lot lower.)

The longest ship ever built (which exceeded the draft limits for Suezmax, so it was out for a different reason) was 458 meters long

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seawise_Giant

... so there might still be an order of magnitude to play with if you were making a ship that was ideally small and maneuverable in other regards.

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#534

Post by hinkley »

doogerdog wrote: post #386

They got traffic flowing sooner than I guessed they could. Three container ships and a livestock carrier have left Bitter lake and are entering the channel right now, heading for Suez. The third one in the group is the Ever Globe, the same size as the stuck ship. I had thought it would take most of today to make sure the channel was clear for the deepest draught vessels. The dredge crews must have done a good job kee…

> The third one in the group is the Ever Globe, the same size as the stuck ship.

What could go wrong.

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#535

Post by SPACE_LAWYER »

HeyLaughingBoy wrote: post #285
pradn wrote: post #207

A great Twitter thread with many articles/resources if you want a critical lens at the global logistics supply chain. https://twitter.com/CharmaineSChua/status/137586855212986368... I found this article on the impact on super-sized ships on logistical infrastructure useful and fascinating. It describes how the creation of ships too big to fit in the Panama canal (post-PANAMAX ships) was received by 1) Panamanians 2)…

>the hydrodynamic effects of these large ships in relatively shallow and narrow canals is underappreciated I'm really surprised I haven't seen this mentioned. A long time ago, I was trained as a merchant ship's navigation officer. One of the things we were taught (but unfortunately had few opportunities to practice), was using "bank cushion" or "bank suction" to use the hydraulic interaction between the hull and a na…

I learned about the bank effect from this article

https://www.ft.com/content/171c92ec-0a44-4dc5-acab-81ee2620d...

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#536

Post by Arn_Thor »

pradn wrote: post #207

A great Twitter thread with many articles/resources if you want a critical lens at the global logistics supply chain. https://twitter.com/CharmaineSChua/status/137586855212986368... I found this article on the impact on super-sized ships on logistical infrastructure useful and fascinating. It describes how the creation of ships too big to fit in the Panama canal (post-PANAMAX ships) was received by 1) Panamanians 2)…

Fantastic thread! Thank you for sharing. This has dramatically expanded my "to read" list

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#537

Post by dkdk8283 »

JosephRedfern wrote: post #62

Lots of articles quote a $XXX billion dollars per day figure, but those numbers are normally for "worth of goods delayed" which, while interesting, doesn't tell the story to me. Are there any estimates as to the actual cost of this "mishap", due to e.g. spoilage, financial/contractual repercussions of late deliveries, personnel/fuel costs?

The actual cost is $$ million in total, substantially less than a billion.

Source: friend who is a merchant marine officer

I expect commodity prices and spot shipping will jump short term but long term disaster avoided.

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#539

Post by sellyme »

djhn wrote: post #464
piyh wrote: post #452

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not blocking the canal, I'm testing robustness! Also in the big picture with covid not being as deadly as it could have been, could serve as a nice dress rehearsal for a captain trips.

We theoretically may have avoided, for the next few decades, the risk of a truly dangerous infectious disease being underestimated, something halfway between Covid and extinction-level threat.

Given the sheer quantity of idiots underestimating it right now, I'm not too sure that things will have improved a few decades down the line.

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#540

Post by Johnny555 »

sharken wrote: post #190
lisper wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Drama sells better than facts.

I wish it wasn't so, but it is. Early on it was reported that it could take weeks to reopen the passage, with a cost of billions to the world trade. Now, just one week later it's open again, barely enough time to make the alternate route a good idea. These rather unrealistic projections seem to have started with the Coronavirus reporting and is an interesting phenomenon in itself.

it was reported that it could take weeks to reopen the passage

That's true - it could have taken weeks and the cost of spoiled or delayed cargo could have reached billions.

After a day of tugs unsuccessfully trying to free the ship, there was no reason to assume it would be a fast recovery.

But the same news that said "it could take weeks" also reported on the ongoing efforts.

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