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How to Criticize Computer Scientists (2001)

cs.purdue.edu

51–60 of 104 posts

Re: How to Criticize Computer Scientists (2001)

#51

> they secretly dream about impressing mathematicians This made me chuckle, and then I read this: > systems researchers will light up when telling you that they have constructed a system that is twice as fast, half the size, and more powerful than its predecessor and thought "Oh God, that is me"! (I'm not in research) I almost don't want to read the rest. On a (possibly) less personal topic, I've found that non-compu…

> I've found that non-computer science researchers who program will dismiss all help with "it doesn't need to be run by anyone else",

I used to work with bioinformaticians, and often wasn't impressed by a lot of the code that they churned out. But to be fair a lot of the work was just to produce a one off graph / heatmap to prove or disprove something, so most of the time it wasn't so important.

> I can barely understand code I wrote 6 months ago and I've written plenty of Perl in the past, too. The idea that code should be so easily understood that to ask a question would make one seem inadequate strikes me as a fanciful dream.

This was a big learning experience for me. I wrote and maintained a Django based system for four and a half years. When I couldn't understand my own code a few months later it was time to refactor. Ask yourself why you don't understand it and how you would expect it to be if it was written in an easier to understand way. It will save you time in the long run. Ex-colleagues commented that they found my code / database design fairly logical after I had left that job.

Re: How to Criticize Computer Scientists (2001)

#52
post #11

I feel it misses a reliable take-down of the systems people. Recipe: (1) ask the person if they have evaluated some framework which would take months to evaluate; (2) suggest that their hard work reinvents the wheel; (3) step back and enjoy a smug victory. On the odd occasion that they have evaluated the framework you named, you can simply try again a few minutes later with a different framework. If you are challenge…

You can attack them even if you have no idea what they are doing. Just look at the plots in the report and mumble something about "missing confidence intervals", "unrealistic workload", and "it's not even heavy tailed".

"Missing confidence intervals" is my (IMO) legit pet peeve.

People fit frighteningly complicated models with millions-to-billions of parameters. They throw in hairy regularization schemes justified by fancy math.

When it comes time to evaluate the output, however: "Our model is better because this one number is bigger than their number [once, on this one test set]."

Re: How to Criticize Computer Scientists (2001)

#53
post #42

> Have you tested this on the chip Intel got running last week in their lab? This is my favorite, not because I've heard this particular one, but because I've heard this vein of low-effort comment after nearly every talk I've ever seen. "Did you consider this specific aspect of niche-thing-only-I'm-working-on?" Some people seem to always look for the opportunity to show how much they know about a topic rather than ac…

> "Did you consider this specific aspect of niche-thing-only-I'm-working-on?"

I've seen 2 kinds of people that usually make this comment. Some do because niche-thing is the one they currently know better, and they have to make some comment, so they ask about what they know better. The others are the more interesting kind, they ask because they want to use niche-thing in some new way, so if you did for a chance consider it, they are very interested in it, and if you didn't, it may be an opportunity for them.

Re: How to Criticize Computer Scientists (2001)

#55
Can confirm. I once watched an engineer build a beautiful, functional subscription management system. When I asked him some practical questions he said "Elegant programs allow us to code as though the physical machine doesn't exist"

The only problem was that under real conditions his code behaved like the stack was infinite; you know like it is in a theoretical computer.

Re: How to Criticize Computer Scientists (2001)

#56

> In fact, this is merely an extension of a ploy used by children on a playground: "Oh yeah? I could have done that if I wanted to." Or by adult professionals on Hacker News.

What a lame comment. I could have written one better If I had the time!

What a lame comment. I could have written one better If I had the time!

Re: How to Criticize Computer Scientists (2001)

#57
post #2

As an engineer supporting researchers I ran into a peculiar problem. If I suggested an idea they often HAD to ignore it, because they couldn't claim it as their own. Especially the grad students who were trying to get a PhD by coming up with a unique idea of their own, but also the profs because it would be an admission that they "the experts" didn't understand what they were doing. So I had to lead them to come roun…

> "the experts" didn't understand what they were doing. So I had to lead them to come round to a perspective so they could think it was their own idea and hence be comfortable adopting it.

This also applies to industry. This is basically managing up 101 for engineers. If the boss thinks it's their idea, it'll get approved and supported. If they think it's someone else's idea, depending on environment, it'll get blocked or sabotaged.

Re: How to Criticize Computer Scientists (2001)

#58
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nice comment, but you should rewrite it in Rust.

Nah man, Rust has overplayed its hand and has been turned into a meme. We need a new Rust that's exactly like the old Rust before it was cool.

Yeah, come on, write it in Nim or don't write it at all.

Re: How to Criticize Computer Scientists (2001)

#60
This is very true. In all peer reviews I've sat through, you can see these two types pop up again and again. The deft presenter will play the counter-type argument (and including with bounds to allow switching between the two viewepoints):

"There's no mathematical rigor" --> "That's a strength, it's simple, performant, and therefore easy to verify for our use cases"

"This is unnecessarily complex, and anyway you've ignored the constants. Our N is small." --> "Asymptotic performance just let's us sleep at night knowing it'll never be that bad. Here's a plot of the predicted and actual cost over our sized N's, you can see they agree well".

Perhaps the moral of the story is, be an engineer for your use cases, and a theorist for scaling.

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