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“I am announcing my resignation from the FSF board”

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Re: “I am announcing my resignation from the FSF board”

#71

Post by mantas »

dragonwriter wrote: post #66
mantas wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is bringing people together - RMS-style "we're here to code" or progressive "everything is politics"?

> RMS-style "we're here to code" or progressive "everything is politics" Richard Stallman is definitely an “everything is politics” type. If he ever was on the “we’re here to code” side, it was before he ran into the issues that led him to found the FSF, which is also an everything-is-politics organization. You might prefer an aloof, privileged “we’re here to code” attitude, but projecting that onto Richard Stallman…

When you got to pick sides and there's no nuance left, RMS is less politics than cancel culture.

Re: “I am announcing my resignation from the FSF board”

#72

Post by mantas »

geofft wrote: post #65
vsdawn wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed "we're here to code" is the winner. Anything else just turns software into high school popularity contests, and there are thousands of other organizations who cater to that.

It's kind of incredible that the position of "we're here to code" is being attributed to RMS. He strenuously fought against that position for so long. It's why he objected to accepting the term "open source," even though the open source movement was producing free software and vice versa. It's why he designed GCC in a way to make it hard to add proprietary add-ons and rejected changes to make it more modular, a chang…

Code licensing is an essential part of coding.

Re: “I am announcing my resignation from the FSF board”

#73

Post by angry_octet »

user-the-name wrote: post #69
thefz wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nobody can make a case that RMS is a swell guy, he's awful. Still, he's without a sliver of a doubt the single most influential activist for FOSS that there's ever been. Amen to that. The sentiment around seems to ultimately be "I just don't like him because he might have made people uncomfortable, make him go away".

No, it is "he is abusive and a sexual harasser, make him go away". That is a 100% reasonable and sane request that nobody should have a problem with.

The counter argument seems to be: "you're victimising a Great Man and that means you're against Free Software and a dirty SJW."

Re: “I am announcing my resignation from the FSF board”

#74

Post by drcongo »

12ian34 wrote: post #54

to all the Stallman supporters - sure he's a genius and sure, he created the FSF, but how can you advocate for someone to be in a very public leadership position, anywhere when they hold and publicise such deplorable and potentially harmful views on topics such as rape, misogyny and paedophilia? This isn't about freedom of speech, this is about avoiding setting a public example that these things are ok, which they ab…

Judging by your downvotes with no replies, the typical HN user finds your post much more worthy of suppression than RMS' pro-child-sex comments.

Re: “I am announcing my resignation from the FSF board”

#75

Post by dragonwriter »

mantas wrote: post #71
dragonwriter wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> RMS-style "we're here to code" or progressive "everything is politics" Richard Stallman is definitely an “everything is politics” type. If he ever was on the “we’re here to code” side, it was before he ran into the issues that led him to found the FSF, which is also an everything-is-politics organization. You might prefer an aloof, privileged “we’re here to code” attitude, but projecting that onto Richard Stallman…

When you got to pick sides and there's no nuance left, RMS is less politics than cancel culture.

> When you got to pick sides and there's no nuance left

That's exactly RMS’s perennial position.

The only difference between him and the most extreme trigger-happy advocate of some specific narrow position on gender or racial politics is the subject area on which Stallman focusses.

Re: “I am announcing my resignation from the FSF board”

#77

Post by mantas »

dragonwriter wrote: post #75
mantas wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you got to pick sides and there's no nuance left, RMS is less politics than cancel culture.

> When you got to pick sides and there's no nuance left That's exactly RMS’s perennial position. The only difference between him and the most extreme trigger-happy advocate of some specific narrow position on gender or racial politics is the subject area on which Stallman focusses.

Yes. And I'd rather keep those subjects separate. Let's talk code extremism in code world and other circles can keep their extremists. Otherwise any subject would be fragmented to no end.

Just think if open source activists would refuse to participate in (non-programming) political activities because invite was made with M$ Word.

Re: “I am announcing my resignation from the FSF board”

#78

Post by joshuamorton »

mantas wrote: post #77
dragonwriter wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> When you got to pick sides and there's no nuance left That's exactly RMS’s perennial position. The only difference between him and the most extreme trigger-happy advocate of some specific narrow position on gender or racial politics is the subject area on which Stallman focusses.

Yes. And I'd rather keep those subjects separate. Let's talk code extremism in code world and other circles can keep their extremists. Otherwise any subject would be fragmented to no end. Just think if open source activists would refuse to participate in (non-programming) political activities because invite was made with M$ Word.

Rms does essentially that.

Re: “I am announcing my resignation from the FSF board”

#79

Post by 12ian34 »

drcongo wrote: post #74
12ian34 wrote: post #54

to all the Stallman supporters - sure he's a genius and sure, he created the FSF, but how can you advocate for someone to be in a very public leadership position, anywhere when they hold and publicise such deplorable and potentially harmful views on topics such as rape, misogyny and paedophilia? This isn't about freedom of speech, this is about avoiding setting a public example that these things are ok, which they ab…

Judging by your downvotes with no replies, the typical HN user finds your post much more worthy of suppression than RMS' pro-child-sex comments.

indeed ... I'd at least appreciate someone providing a challenge to what I'm saying. Surely, proper discourse on the topic is merited rather than suppression. I suppose downvoting is the easier way of disagreeing. I'm extremely open to being challenged - I don't personally know the guy and I don't know every detail.

Re: “I am announcing my resignation from the FSF board”

#80

Post by throw0101a »

rich_sasha wrote: post #31

I don’t know much more than superficial things about either FSF or RMS. I read the things he said, they sound reasonable, but very prone to misinterpretation. I won’t jump to his defence, I think not offending people even through their misunderstandings is a key skill in public speech. I do find it terrifying though how he is lynched for what is essentially rational and permissible speech in an ugly wrapper. I don’t…

> I do find it terrifying though how he is lynched for what is essentially rational and permissible speech in an ugly wrapper.

What he said in 2019 was basically the last straw for many people of behaviour that stretches back a decade or three:

* https://selamjie.medium.com/remove-richard-stallman-appendix...

He hasn't admitted to doing anything wrong, or feeling regret for any words/actions, and so the thinking is if he won't ask for forgiveness (?) then why should he be let back in?

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