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The price students pay for a prized IIT seat

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Re: The price students pay for a prized IIT seat

#151

Post by agent008t »

cmdli wrote: post #9
bluefirebrand wrote: post #4

There is an argument to be made that to be the best at something you have to commit like that. You could write a similar story about pro athletes probably, although team sports would include some level of socialization by default, not all sports are team sports. And I imagine a lot of other sacrifices (friendships outside the team or sport, hobbies, education) are made in pursuit of a pro athlete dream too. And of co…

It seems to me that the problem is what these students should be the "best" at. Taking tests and learning academic material? They appear to be super successful. Being able to navigate the world of business and working with other people? Well, they aren't learning all the soft skills and life experience they need. I see this partially as a failure of the metrics used for acceptance. Social skills and other activities…

The academic institution is in the business of teaching. Its job is not to try and predict who will end up being the highest earner. It is arguably to pick students who have demonstrated that they want to and are able to study. Social skills and other activities are almost completely irrelevant, unless they relate to the chosen field of study.

Re: The price students pay for a prized IIT seat

#152

Post by clappski »

flowerlad wrote: post #105
Zhenya wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think to check off they tickets, the first need to submit the fix and have it merged

JIRA tickets are typically used in IT departments. Do you really have to go outside the country to find people good enough to work in IT?

JIRA tickets are used by everyone managing every sort of project. Development teams, recruitment pipelines, long term strategy - thinking that it's just for 'IT' is silly.

Re: The price students pay for a prized IIT seat

#153

Post by primitivesuave »

random314 wrote: post #147
primitivesuave wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're right if you're thinking about American universities, but IIT operates much differently (this may have changed, so IIT students, please correct me if I'm wrong here). No student enters IIT declaring a CS major like an American university - they have to first excel at test-taking within IIT across a range of subjects (chemistry, physics, etc), so they can be part of the top cohort within IIT that is allowed to…

IIT students pick their major before joining the university.

Thanks for clarifying, glad to be wrong about this one. Would you happen to know if this was true at some point?

Re: The price students pay for a prized IIT seat

#154

Post by sudhackar »

primitivesuave wrote: post #153
random314 wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IIT students pick their major before joining the university.

Thanks for clarifying, glad to be wrong about this one. Would you happen to know if this was true at some point?

AFAIR to choose your major you'd to fill a list of preferences - priority of majors in different IITs. These are then awarded based on merit - rank in the JEE(Joint Entrance Exam). So if you want a specific major at a specific IIT you'll have to get higher ranks in the JEE.

Re: The price students pay for a prized IIT seat

#155

Post by TrackerFF »

Every time I read these testimonials from Asian students - how they're basically devoting their entire youths for some entrance exam, or college majors, I can't help but feel incredibly thankful that I'm from a western/nordic country.

It just sounds so alien that people would live like that - but at the same time, it's completely understandable. The payoff can be life-altering, so it's really no different than would-be athletes here, that devote their lives for the sport, because first prize could be pro-sports contract with multi-million salaries, while second prize is basically a set of stake knives, in the long run.

When I grew up, I spent maybe an hour on homework? If that. Granted, we had very, very little rote learning, and the school system put a lot of emphasis on conceptual understanding. We simply did not participate in problem-grinding.

Same for college and university. Undergrad was quite hectic, but the workload was much higher than anything I had experienced before. Still, I don't know a single student from my class that studied from morning to night.

If anything, I hope they got the payoff they were hoping for.

Re: The price students pay for a prized IIT seat

#156

Post by flowerlad »

primitivesuave wrote: post #123
flowerlad wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Something is really wrong, if he highly capable kids are checking off "JIRA tickets". Couldn't you find some college dropouts in Oklahoma instead?

I think the wording may have been confusing there, I meant that some developers tend to define their work to be exactly what is assigned to them on project management.

This is what you said: I have been hiring IIT graduates and building a team in India for several years now. They are all really smart people with a strong work ethic, but their approach to work tends to be the same as the approach they needed to succeed in a test-based education system. ... nobody will stop to ask why things are being done a particular way, or offer up some alternative.

Which is of course nonsense. The same test-based education system also produced leaders such as the CEO of Google, CEO of IBM and the CEO of Albertsons. If you have been able to hire some to close "JIRA tickets" you scraped the bottom of the barrel and maybe you shouldn't be making generalized conclusions based on your observations!

Re: The price students pay for a prized IIT seat

#157

Post by darth_avocado »

jackmusk wrote: post #144
darth_avocado wrote: post #75

This article is a gross misrepresentation of what it takes to get into IITs. I got into one, and I can guarantee that this article pretty much picks and chooses data points as it wants. Yes it is academically challenging to get into IITs, but there's two ways you can get into one: Devote your entire life towards "cracking" the game that's the entrance exams, or just study enough that you've mastered the understanding…

No it is not. Just because it worked out for you doesn't mean it worked out for all of us. I still have PTSD from my 12th standard days... all that mindless cramming physics and chemistry just so I could go to a good college and study CS. Me and my peers were actively discouraged to take a harder subject like economics or CS as the 5th subject so we could focus on Physics,chen and maths. We went to school then tuitio…

> Just because it worked out for you doesn't mean it worked out for all of us.

That is exactly what I said. The experience described in the article is just one side of the story, which I never denied exists, but that isn't the only side of the story. Also let me rephrase what you said, "Just because it didn't work out for you, doesn't mean it didn't for everyone else". Therefore, a need for a balanced point of view.

Re: The price students pay for a prized IIT seat

#158

Post by darth_avocado »

abc_lisper wrote: post #131
darth_avocado wrote: post #75

This article is a gross misrepresentation of what it takes to get into IITs. I got into one, and I can guarantee that this article pretty much picks and chooses data points as it wants. Yes it is academically challenging to get into IITs, but there's two ways you can get into one: Devote your entire life towards "cracking" the game that's the entrance exams, or just study enough that you've mastered the understanding…

Where did you go to school, if I may ask. This seems like a dream to me, and not relatable at all as a student from India

The biggest public schooling system with blue and white uniforms. ;)

Re: The price students pay for a prized IIT seat

#159

Post by abc_lisper »

sfashset wrote: post #149
abc_lisper wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you do now?

he's a SDE at Amazon

Why the feeling of failure then ? There is nothing there that is not in your company now. You are not a graded apple to be sold at a store. If you are intelligent you will recognize these are human constructs, and nature/problems don’t recognize your degree - they are available for everyone

Re: The price students pay for a prized IIT seat

#160

Post by abc_lisper »

jackmusk wrote: post #144
darth_avocado wrote: post #75

This article is a gross misrepresentation of what it takes to get into IITs. I got into one, and I can guarantee that this article pretty much picks and chooses data points as it wants. Yes it is academically challenging to get into IITs, but there's two ways you can get into one: Devote your entire life towards "cracking" the game that's the entrance exams, or just study enough that you've mastered the understanding…

No it is not. Just because it worked out for you doesn't mean it worked out for all of us. I still have PTSD from my 12th standard days... all that mindless cramming physics and chemistry just so I could go to a good college and study CS. Me and my peers were actively discouraged to take a harder subject like economics or CS as the 5th subject so we could focus on Physics,chen and maths. We went to school then tuitio…

Amen brother! This is why it is important to not take things at face value, like most of our country men. Just because India was a poor country and IIT was a good way out, it doesn’t mean there aren’t other paths. This is just myopia induced by scarcity and poverty
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