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A new moralism is gripping the literary world

persuasion.community

261–270 of 293 posts

Re: A new moralism is gripping the literary world

#261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's been removed from the front page too. Yep, it's messed up.

I'm a bit of an HN neophyte, having recently left FB for a place where thoughtful discussion was still welcome. I'm not being rhetorical when I ask, what is going on? Are some highly-rated users just abusing their power to flag, or is this something else? Is HN on its way to being more concerned with virtue signaling than open discussion?

"If a story is spam or off-topic, flag it."[1]

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: A new moralism is gripping the literary world

#262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a bit of an HN neophyte, having recently left FB for a place where thoughtful discussion was still welcome. I'm not being rhetorical when I ask, what is going on? Are some highly-rated users just abusing their power to flag, or is this something else? Is HN on its way to being more concerned with virtue signaling than open discussion?

"If a story is spam or off-topic, flag it."[1] [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Some flag that which they find disagreeable too, of course.

Re: A new moralism is gripping the literary world

#263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

non-ants would get outraged on behalf of the ants.

Who cares. If someone misappropriated my culture for an entire movie I'll be pretty mad, who cares if someone else also took offence. I feel like this kind of argument only serves as distraction (not implying that's your intent). Do you not think ant culture would be absolutely offended by someone doing this?

I think that getting "pretty mad" over something that that is kinda nuts. It would be on the same level as somebody "stealing" my hair style.

You people make mountains out of molehills.

Re: A new moralism is gripping the literary world

#264
post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Guessing right most of the time isn't knowing. And people not knowing how sex and gender differ doesn't change the fact that they rely on gender markers lots and chromosomes never. People who menstruate is much shorter than your suggestion.

>Guessing right most of the time isn't knowing. And people not knowing how sex and gender differ doesn't change the fact that they rely on gender markers lots and chromosomes never. "gender markers" and "chromosomes" are the same thing for 99% of the population. So guessing really is knowing. > People who menstruate is much shorter than your suggestion. Women is even shorter and everybody in the whole world understan…

I think most people understand chromosomes are too small to see.

People who menstruate is more accurate.

Re: A new moralism is gripping the literary world

#265
post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Excluding someone from a domestic violence shelter isn't just a way of thinking about something. Imprisoning people more likely to be raped with people more likely to rape them isn't just a way of thinking about something. Cis and trans are opposites by definition. They existed long before they were applied to gender.

> Excluding someone from a domestic violence shelter isn't just a way of thinking about something. Imprisoning people more likely to be raped with people more likely to rape them isn't just a way of thinking about something. True, but the relevance is not obvious because these aren’t problems caused by so called TERFs. It’s also not true that censoring JK Rowling is required as part of solving them, either. > Cis and…

TE people advocate policies that create those outcomes. I've seen none support creation of separate but equal facilities for trans people. It's too costly for such a small minority they say.

Rowling hasn't been censored.

Cis women and trans women are in the category of women.

Re: A new moralism is gripping the literary world

#266
post #55

> https://www.theguardian.com/books/2021/mar/10/not-suitable-c... This extends beyond the contents of the book. Here a "white" (but really Catalan) man was fired from translating a poem because his identity didn't mirror the poet's.

When will the insanity end?

Educating others, communicating events, and discussing these cultural touchstones is the beginning of the end for such things. It's a process (I think), and we're all collectively part of it. The end of this particular cycle may not have a definitive date though.

I want to stress that honest and open communication about opinions and a commitment to truth and the long process of fact-checking seems to be the best way forward, if not necessarily the easiest.

Re: A new moralism is gripping the literary world

#267
post #42

Look at many of our popular online comics for examples of this. What do we call this, "populist fascism"?

I'm really out of the loop, what is going on in online comics?

A vast carefulness is occurring. A ubiquitous attempt to stay on the right side of the twitter mob.

Re: A new moralism is gripping the literary world

#268
post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Excluding someone from a domestic violence shelter isn't just a way of thinking about something. Imprisoning people more likely to be raped with people more likely to rape them isn't just a way of thinking about something. True, but the relevance is not obvious because these aren’t problems caused by so called TERFs. It’s also not true that censoring JK Rowling is required as part of solving them, either. > Cis and…

TE people advocate policies that create those outcomes. I've seen none support creation of separate but equal facilities for trans people. It's too costly for such a small minority they say. Rowling hasn't been censored. Cis women and trans women are in the category of women.

> TE people advocate policies that create those outcomes.

This just isn’t true.

> I've seen none support creation of separate but equal facilities for trans people. It's too costly for such a small minority they say.

TERFs don’t say this. People controlling budgets do. They are are the ones withholding services from trans people. Not TERFs.

> Cis women and trans women are in the category of women.

Only according to certain trans perspectives.

You have clearly agreed there are two kinds of women. It is reasonable for them to not see one another as members of the same category.

Re: A new moralism is gripping the literary world

#269
post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a WASP man myself, I think you need to put the computer down. Or do you want to pretend that computers weren’t invented by my people?

Who cares who invented it? Do you think babbage designed the fabs TSMC uses now?

So by your definition, White people can write books about the Black experience because they contributed to it.

Re: A new moralism is gripping the literary world

#270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This also applies to art in general. Marcel Duchamps Fountain was one of my favorite pieces of art because it called out the art world for judging art based on the fact that it was made by a member of the accepted 'art world' but it was a frickin urinal.

I didn't think that was the point. I thought that the point was that, within certain flavors of philosophy, there is no such thing as beauty (that is, beauty has no objective reality), and therefore that anything could be regarded as being art. Duchamps' point was that this urinal was as good as the Mona Lisa; that is, Duchamps really agreed with this viewpoint (if I understand correctly). He got upset when critics c…

It beggers the question of 'what is art'?

What actually MADE that urinal art was that it was made by a member of the artistic ingroup.

If I go hang a urinal in a museum as a web developer I will get arrested and it will be thrown out.

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