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Why I won't be using Groupon again.. A consumer perspective.

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Re: Why I won't be using Groupon again.. A consumer perspective.

#91

Post by robobenjie »

bdhe wrote: post #46
hnsmurf wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Groupon customers are definitely poor tippers. I've known a number of waiters to complain about it. The problem is they tip on the Groupon price, not the full price, and are thus tipping something like 40% of what they should be.

The problem is they tip on the Groupon price, not the full price, and are thus tipping something like 40% of what they should be. I am not intimately familiar with the tipping culture (at least in the US), but here are some genuine questions: Is there an inherent reason you tip on the full price? Is it a tax? If tipping is to support staff wages does that mean waiters who serve fancier higher priced food items are en…

Also places that have more expensive food tend to have more people to spread the tips around on. The waiter splits the tip with the person busing tables, the person refilling your water glass, the host etc.

Re: Why I won't be using Groupon again.. A consumer perspective.

#92

Post by jeromec »

noodle wrote: post #85
jeromec wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

wait staff in the US make around $2-3/hour. they aren't paid a living wage. Not true. That's why we have federal minimum wage laws. If the wait staff are actually employed and not acting as independent contractors, then they are paid the minimum wage for their state. (Although I will grant that this being a living wage is definitely arguable.) Edit: Correction - although not California (my state), apparently some sta…

yes, you're right, what i said wasn't fully true for expediency's sake, but your statement isn't fully true either. federal minimum wage laws don't apply to tipped workers in the same way (iirc, it varies based on the state, i'm not sure). if an employee doesn't at least make minimum wage after tips are considered, an employer is required by law to compensate an employee up to the point where they do make minimum wag…

Yes, I added a correction.

Re: Why I won't be using Groupon again.. A consumer perspective.

#93

Post by 3am »

Bud wrote: post #51
hvs wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

She/he shouldn't have to. Groupon customers should be tipping on what the full amount would've been without the Groupon.

The onus could just as fairly be applied to Groupon itself as to its customers; shouldn't Groupon be helping the restaurants it does business with, by encouraging/reminding customers to tip servers fairly, and not harm the staff of its business partners?

They encourage that prominently in several places, including this message on the actually coupon voucher:

"*Remember: Groupon customers tip on the full amount of the pre-discounted bill (and tip generously). That's why we are the coolest customers out there."

I've got no lost love for GroupOn, but this massive pile on/proof by anecdote thing is not a dignified moment for HN.

Re: Why I won't be using Groupon again.. A consumer perspective.

#94

Post by ghshephard »

patio11 wrote: post #57
bdhe wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is they tip on the Groupon price, not the full price, and are thus tipping something like 40% of what they should be. I am not intimately familiar with the tipping culture (at least in the US), but here are some genuine questions: Is there an inherent reason you tip on the full price? Is it a tax? If tipping is to support staff wages does that mean waiters who serve fancier higher priced food items are en…

IAmerican tipping culture: there is a near-involiate presumption that wait staff gets tipped N% of the order. Customary practice recently is N is 20. Theoretically, tips are tied to service received. In practice, variation from societal norms is vanishingly rare in polite company. Waiters in higher priced restaurants do make better tips as a consequence of this. That might matter if the culture were designed. It was…

Side note - in California 18.5% is the customary practice for tips, though, to make it easy, you can round up to 20%. No service person will complain. If you get lackluster service, you can point it out with a 15% tip. Poor service gets a 10% tip, and, will make it clear you are unhappy.

After 15 years of doing this (I'm from Canada, where tips aren't as proscribed, though they are still expected) I find it awkward and socially painful to pay the bill in countries in which there is not a tip expected (certain parts of Australia) - even though the locals assure me that no one will think the less of me.

Re: Why I won't be using Groupon again.. A consumer perspective.

#96

Post by hnal943 »

lucisferre wrote: post #83

I wasn't aware tipping was all that common in the UK but here in Canada I would be wary of using Groupon for that exact reason. Personally I find tipping to be a nearly meaningless exercise (nearly because occasionally great service deserves a bit extra). Because I live in a country where we are expected to tip, restaurant owners do (and are allowed to with lower minimum wages) expect to be able to underpay their sta…

I'm tired of being responsible for someone elses paycheck. What's the alternative? Do you think the total cost of the night out would go down if the waitstaff was paid more? You're going to be paying their salary one way or the other, it's better that you get some input on their performance I think.

Re: Why I won't be using Groupon again.. A consumer perspective.

#97

Post by dclowd9901 »

patio11 wrote: post #9

I think you might be overestimating how much insight the waitress has into the business. It may be the case that this was a close, family-held restaurant and they have a daily pow-wow on cost of goods and marketing strategy, but I wouldn't bet that way. My guess? Groupon customers are poor tippers, either from adverse selection or because they either a) attempt to tip with leftover funny-money or b) tip based on the…

This is why I despise using coupons (or gift cards, for that matter) in restaurants in general. Coupons, like it or not, have a distinct stigma associated with them that never nets you a pleasant restaurant experience.

More than anything else, I think the OP is complaining about restauranting with a coupon/gift card rather than utilizing Groupon, specifically. That said, he's correct that the model is broken for this very reason.

Re: Why I won't be using Groupon again.. A consumer perspective.

#98

Post by glenngillen »

lucisferre wrote: post #83

I wasn't aware tipping was all that common in the UK but here in Canada I would be wary of using Groupon for that exact reason. Personally I find tipping to be a nearly meaningless exercise (nearly because occasionally great service deserves a bit extra). Because I live in a country where we are expected to tip, restaurant owners do (and are allowed to with lower minimum wages) expect to be able to underpay their sta…

You've hit a few proverbial nails on the head for me there. Having lived primarily in a number of countries where tipping was entirely optional and rarely more than 10%, I still find it awkward when I travel to the US. I generally follow the 20% lead these days but the figure is always determined based off the service I've received, as I've justified the absurdity of it as "the wait staff get ripped off by not being paid a fair wage and I have to top it up for them". There have been occasions where we've dined in quite expensive restaurants in NY and the food has been bad enough for me to send back (something I'll rarely do). But on both occasions the wait staff were polite and understanding and stuck the items off the final bill. I stilled tipped at 20% of the original bill + a little extra because at the end of the day the fact the meal wasn't cooked wasn't their fault and I didn't think they should be punished for it. Sharing that tip with the rest of the staff makes a mockery of the whole process and my justification.

And then I think; In almost every other profession you're expected to do your job to the best of your ability every day. Your "tip" is still being employed the following week.

Re: Why I won't be using Groupon again.. A consumer perspective.

#99

Post by kenjackson »

patio11 wrote: post #9

I think you might be overestimating how much insight the waitress has into the business. It may be the case that this was a close, family-held restaurant and they have a daily pow-wow on cost of goods and marketing strategy, but I wouldn't bet that way. My guess? Groupon customers are poor tippers, either from adverse selection or because they either a) attempt to tip with leftover funny-money or b) tip based on the…

I know one hamburger restaurant chain here in Seattle, the Counter, that is now on the second round of Groupon, and this round they offered two coupons per customer -- so my thought is the first round couldn't have went too poorly.

I went in with a Groupon and the experience was first class. Great service. They actually had one guy whose main job was to scan the Groupons. I asked him how things were businesswise with Groupon and he said really busy, but he said now that they can just scan them in, pretty easy (last round they had to look up each coupon by hand).

I of course tipped on the full amount, plus some, because the service was excellent. I liked my meal, and the wife and kids did too. We'll be back. And this is a place I may not have gone to w/o Groupon, although I had heard positive things from neighbors. But Groupon definitely got us the last mile through the door.

My feeling is that now, as a business owner that can use Google, if you don't know what you're getting into, you probably won't be business long with or w/o Groupon.

Re: Why I won't be using Groupon again.. A consumer perspective.

#100

Post by nametoremember »

mikbetk wrote: post #48

Do you really not understand why the waitress's demeanor changed the moment you mentioned using a coupon? Seriously? You know wait staff live on tips right? You know that people who use coupons are notoriously bad tippers right? There are very, very few people who feel they got a deal so leave a bigger tip. Most leave a tip based on what they paid, not on what the meal should have cost and people that use coupons tip…

Wrong country. In the UK, wait staff don't live on tips.
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