Why are so many successful founding CEOs software engineers? • Hacker News Board

Re: Why are so many successful founding CEOs software engineers?

#101

Post by jiofih » Mon, Mar 15, 2021, 10:02 AM UTC

Number157 wrote: post #85

sebmellen wrote: post #5

Does anyone find this methodology lazy, if not disingenuous? - Google/Alphabet's current CEO is a materials engineer [0] - Apple's current CEO is an MBA with a degree in industrial engineering [1]. Jobs, the founding CEO, was also not a software engineer. - Amazon's CEO, Bezos, was a software engineer [2], but it's widely known that he didn't do programming work for Amazon. I don't think he would consider himself a "…

> Google/Alphabet's current CEO Current, sure, but he showed up after Google was already successful. Becoming the CEO of Google made him successful, but he didn't make Google successful. > Apple's current CEO... Same thing. > Jobs, the founding CEO, was also not a software engineer. True but he co-founded it with a software engineer (Wozniak) who was arguably influential enough that he had the influence of a CEO if n…

Jobs is said to have influenced the choice and use of Objective C at NS significantly - even if he didn’t code, he had enough understanding to guide it. Also his first job at Atari was as a developer, though it’s said that he got Wozniak to do most of it!

Re: Why are so many successful founding CEOs software engineers?

#102

Post by danielmarkbruce » Mon, Mar 15, 2021, 10:05 AM UTC

GeneBond wrote: post #36

bawolff wrote: post #4

Wow, talk about assuming correlation implies causation. I think the obvious lesson here is when society becomes reoriented around a new field (in this case software), people with experience in that field are going to do well.

I'm the author bawolff, and I completely agree that the success of software engineers as CEOs is correlation, not causation. The likely cause is that software engineers learn to discover value by running value experiments. Zuckerberg and Bezos are well known for their value experiments in production. I believe that the nature of pursuing new value, in effect, taught them this practice. And to the comment below, when…

You might not be understanding his/her point...

Re: Why are so many successful founding CEOs software engineers?

#103

Post by hef19898 » Mon, Mar 15, 2021, 10:05 AM UTC

replyifuagree wrote: post #33

teitoklien wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remains to be seen ?? How many more trillion dollar do you need , to give Tim Cook his due credit for operational excellence

Operational excellence he gets all the credit for, just like Ballmer.

Apple is as much a software ompany as it is a hardware company. MS is much more a software company. Cook is a supply chain guy, and with the majority of Apple manufactirung happening at third parties, the operationa excellence is what makes Cook a great CEO, more so because he seems to understand all the other sides of the business as well.

Re: Why are so many successful founding CEOs software engineers?

#104

Post by Ensorceled » Mon, Mar 15, 2021, 10:05 AM UTC

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #96

sebmellen wrote: post #5

Does anyone find this methodology lazy, if not disingenuous? - Google/Alphabet's current CEO is a materials engineer [0] - Apple's current CEO is an MBA with a degree in industrial engineering [1]. Jobs, the founding CEO, was also not a software engineer. - Amazon's CEO, Bezos, was a software engineer [2], but it's widely known that he didn't do programming work for Amazon. I don't think he would consider himself a "…

Yeah I mean they're all CEO's, they don't do software engineering as far as I know. Maybe they once did, 15-20 years ago, and maybe that was their major in uni, but I think it's a bad trend to put a label on people based on what they went to school for. What you pick in school is not your life, and real life / work experience is more educational than the education system (in my experience, but then, I'm college level…

I'm pushing 60 and university is STILL one of the most formative events, if not the most formative event, in my lifetime.

Re: Why are so many successful founding CEOs software engineers?

#105

Post by samatman » Mon, Mar 15, 2021, 10:06 AM UTC

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #96

sebmellen wrote: post #5

Does anyone find this methodology lazy, if not disingenuous? - Google/Alphabet's current CEO is a materials engineer [0] - Apple's current CEO is an MBA with a degree in industrial engineering [1]. Jobs, the founding CEO, was also not a software engineer. - Amazon's CEO, Bezos, was a software engineer [2], but it's widely known that he didn't do programming work for Amazon. I don't think he would consider himself a "…

Yeah I mean they're all CEO's, they don't do software engineering as far as I know. Maybe they once did, 15-20 years ago, and maybe that was their major in uni, but I think it's a bad trend to put a label on people based on what they went to school for. What you pick in school is not your life, and real life / work experience is more educational than the education system (in my experience, but then, I'm college level…

That seems overly reductive.

Most US Congresspersons studied law, most high-ranking Chinese Communist Party members studied engineering. Most of both spent limited time practicing their profession, they're professional politicians, not lawyers or engineers.

It still says something interesting about the respective bodies. If there's some kid out there who wants to grow up to be a CEO, should she study computer science or, like, history?

Re: Why are so many successful founding CEOs software engineers?

#106

Post by kjgkjhfkjf » Mon, Mar 15, 2021, 10:06 AM UTC

Describing Larry, Sergey, and Zuck as software engineers is a bit generous, as I'm sure they'd be the first to admit :)

Re: Why are so many successful founding CEOs software engineers?

#107

Post by hef19898 » Mon, Mar 15, 2021, 10:08 AM UTC

solumos wrote: post #19

sebmellen wrote: post #5

Does anyone find this methodology lazy, if not disingenuous? - Google/Alphabet's current CEO is a materials engineer [0] - Apple's current CEO is an MBA with a degree in industrial engineering [1]. Jobs, the founding CEO, was also not a software engineer. - Amazon's CEO, Bezos, was a software engineer [2], but it's widely known that he didn't do programming work for Amazon. I don't think he would consider himself a "…

Definitely. I'd be interested to see how this breaks down for the S&P 500, with more rigor around what constitutes an engineer - maybe have different categories?

There is a common trope around engineers being better managers and CEo in germany as we.. Not software, but engineers in general. Everyody always points at the successfull ones, only to forget that some of the biggest business fuck ups, e.g. VW, happened under engineering CEOs (without MBAs).

Re: Why are so many successful founding CEOs software engineers?

#108

Post by danielmarkbruce » Mon, Mar 15, 2021, 10:08 AM UTC

Number157 wrote: post #91

fivecour wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why software engineers in particular then, if scientists, inventors, artists, and many others are also known for iterating through and learning from their failures? I also agree with others who said limiting analysis to the top 10 seems arbitrary, especially when you're covering mostly just the runaway outliers despite having the general overall claim of "why are software engineers better CEOs?" Does your analysis st…

The nitpicking on this forum is getting ridiculous.

His criticism is quite valid. It's not nits he is picking. It's the overall argument, which is weak.

Re: Why are so many successful founding CEOs software engineers?

#109

Post by isamuel » Mon, Mar 15, 2021, 10:13 AM UTC

All of the people on this list are "software engineers" in the sense that they have some rudimentary education in the field. Almost none of them could get a job as a software engineer at their own company, if they had to, because they would be completely unqualified. And I'm not looking down my nose at anyone: I have an undergraduate degree in CS, but I got it 16 years ago and then went to law school, and there is not a serious place on earth that would let me touch their codebase. But if I started a really valuable company tomorrow (maybe I should), I would code as a software engineer on this list.

I mean, come at it from the other direction: Why are there so many software engineers who are not successful CEOs? My God, they have the secrets of for loops, S-expressions, they know about vim---and yet they aren't running Pfizer? Why not?

Re: Why are so many successful founding CEOs software engineers?

#110

Post by pydry » Mon, Mar 15, 2021, 10:17 AM UTC

GCA10 wrote: post #23

bawolff wrote: post #4

Wow, talk about assuming correlation implies causation. I think the obvious lesson here is when society becomes reoriented around a new field (in this case software), people with experience in that field are going to do well.

So true! Around 1980, chemical and petroleum engineers made the best CEOs, because oil prices were high and energy companies had the highest stock-market valuations. Around 1990 Japanese finance majors made the best CEOs, because the Japanese financial markets were near their peak and Japanese bank stocks were highly valued.

This might be true but I don't see why it is obvious, especially when it's not even commonly assumed that the best person to run a software company is a software engineer.