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SpaceX delivers 3rd batch of Starlink satellites in two weeks

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Re: SpaceX delivers 3rd batch of Starlink satellites in two weeks

#81

Post by gbrown »

rklaehn wrote: post #55
echopom wrote: post #50

I'm really concerned about the alarms raised by Scientific in regards to "Space Pollution".[0] Elon Musk has been dodging the question for the past years and never gave a clear answer about it aside of "Umbrella" joke... Some astronomers are suggesting that with multiple space telecom companies ( US + EU + China ) it would potentially mean we would never be able to see space in plain sight ever. At least not without…

SpaceX has put in a lot of effort to reduce the visual pollution aspect of starlink. See https://twitter.com/ralfvandebergh/status/136999054076322611... for how the visibility of Starlink sats has changed over time. For professional earth based astronomy, it is possible to remove the streaks digitally. But of course there is a slight impact. But what is the alternative? Just stop development of low earth orbit foreve…

Mirror size is the issue - until we can easily manufacture huge, incredibly precise mirrors in-situ, space based will never replace ground based astronomy.

Re: SpaceX delivers 3rd batch of Starlink satellites in two weeks

#82

Post by robocat »

echopom wrote: post #50

I'm really concerned about the alarms raised by Scientific in regards to "Space Pollution".[0] Elon Musk has been dodging the question for the past years and never gave a clear answer about it aside of "Umbrella" joke... Some astronomers are suggesting that with multiple space telecom companies ( US + EU + China ) it would potentially mean we would never be able to see space in plain sight ever. At least not without…

No different from city light pollution preventing optical telescopes being near cities.

Or radio pollution causing constraints for radio-astronomy.

My guess is that cheap reliable worldwide internet connectivity will help science overall by far more than the costs of modifying terrestrial optical observations to mitigate the extra satellites.

Re: SpaceX delivers 3rd batch of Starlink satellites in two weeks

#83

Post by caconym_ »

echopom wrote: post #50

I'm really concerned about the alarms raised by Scientific in regards to "Space Pollution".[0] Elon Musk has been dodging the question for the past years and never gave a clear answer about it aside of "Umbrella" joke... Some astronomers are suggesting that with multiple space telecom companies ( US + EU + China ) it would potentially mean we would never be able to see space in plain sight ever. At least not without…

SpaceX is taking concrete steps to make their satellites as unobtrusive as possible without significantly compromising their design. Beyond that, this is really a choice between developing space and not. Quit with the FUD about Musk “dodging” questions, etc.—say what you mean, which is that you think pristine night skies should forever take precedence over the economic development of space. Or, if it doesn’t sound good stated so straightforwardly, don’t.

Re: SpaceX delivers 3rd batch of Starlink satellites in two weeks

#84

Post by Demigod33 »

postingawayonhn wrote: post #41
Roritharr wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if the USG would consider the shooting down of Starlink Satellites as an act of war after SpaceX refuses to comply with chinese regulations. It's probably all moot as China would probably simply halt Tesla Sales, as they are not bound by the logics of legality.

I don't think anyone has the ability to shoot down enough Starlink satellites to make a difference. Musk's biggest risk in China is the CCP confiscating the Tesla factory in Shanghai.

> I don't think anyone has the ability to shoot down enough Starlink satellites to make a difference.

Not with rockets, but maybe with lasers? What damage can a single one do? Could a country deploy them at specific orbits to have enough coverage to destroy a sufficient amount?

Re: SpaceX delivers 3rd batch of Starlink satellites in two weeks

#85

Post by sigstoat »

mempko wrote: post #34
aerovistae wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"at our expense"? You clearly don't have to deal with rural internet if you think this is a net loss for society.

It could have been a non-profit operation no? I would expect rural internet to be cheaper than what SpaceX is charging. $100 per month is very expensive, especially for people in rural areas which generally are poorer. Example, I believe over 90% of rural china has high speed internet and they pay less than $10 a month. Edit. Anyone have a good argument why we can't get $10 per month high speed internet in rural area…

> Anyone have a good argument why we can't get $10 per month high speed internet in rural areas in the USA?

do you have any idea how much it costs to dig a trench? look up a calculator for figuring out the present value of a perpetuity that pays $10/mo. that will barely cover somebody digging a trench through your front yard, and laying fiber in it, let alone doing that down miles of rural street.

Re: SpaceX delivers 3rd batch of Starlink satellites in two weeks

#86

Post by tidepod12 »

jiofih wrote: post #57
echopom wrote: post #50

I'm really concerned about the alarms raised by Scientific in regards to "Space Pollution".[0] Elon Musk has been dodging the question for the past years and never gave a clear answer about it aside of "Umbrella" joke... Some astronomers are suggesting that with multiple space telecom companies ( US + EU + China ) it would potentially mean we would never be able to see space in plain sight ever. At least not without…

There are already 1200 of them in orbit, can you go outside and point at a single one? When this controversy was started they addressed concerns by reducing the satellites reflectance and it seems to have worked.

A couple points:

1) 1200 is a small percentage of the tens of thousands of satellites that the full system, plus the other similar systems will eventually consist of.

2) Being able to go outside and point out a satellite has absolutely no relevance on the satellite's impact on professional astronomy.

3) It did not "seem to have worked". SpaceX experimented with reducing the reflectivity of their satellites, but only some satellites have that reduced reflectivity, and astronomers found them to be only marginally better.

Re: SpaceX delivers 3rd batch of Starlink satellites in two weeks

#87

Post by Robotbeat »

rklaehn wrote: post #58
joezydeco wrote: post #15

So where is Amazon in relation to all of this? I got pinged by a recruiter from Kuiper the other week and all I can see is that there's no way they're on track to be working in 5 years. They don't even have a stable launch platform. Would Musk sell Bezos the ride?

I think SpaceX would sell them launches. First of all, why wouldn't they? They are confident that their satellite tech is superior. And second, SpaceX is dominating the commercial launch market to such a degree that they would run into antitrust issues if they were to use their launch dominance for antocompetitive behaviour. But Bezos would probably be too proud to launch on SpaceX...

Yeah, I agree. And this would be one reason to spin off Starlink in an IPO. So customers would be okay with SpaceX launching their constellation.

Re: SpaceX delivers 3rd batch of Starlink satellites in two weeks

#88

Post by Robotbeat »

MetaWhirledPeas wrote: post #37
joezydeco wrote: post #15

So where is Amazon in relation to all of this? I got pinged by a recruiter from Kuiper the other week and all I can see is that there's no way they're on track to be working in 5 years. They don't even have a stable launch platform. Would Musk sell Bezos the ride?

Bezos is in it only because he too has a rocket company. If he wanted to be in the business of feeding on the scraps of others he'd release his own terrestrial internet service.

That’s why Elon’s in it with Starlink. From Elon’s perspective, if Starlink merely breaks even, it will be more than worth it as it has drastically increased launch demand, enabling high flight rate reusable rockets.

Re: SpaceX delivers 3rd batch of Starlink satellites in two weeks

#89

Post by tidepod12 »

dillondoyle wrote: post #77
rklaehn wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any major space power (Russia, China, India) will be able to dictate the conditions of Starlink operations. Basically: dear SpaceX, please switch off your sats over our territory, or we will do it for you.

talk about space debris - blowing up that many satellites would be insane.

It would only take blowing up one satellite to let the world know they're serious about it, at which point SpaceX would almost certainly be forced to comply with China's demands, if only because SpaceX would have to acknowledge that the debris from even a handful of destroyed satellites would cause serious danger to the operations of the rest of the constellation.

Re: SpaceX delivers 3rd batch of Starlink satellites in two weeks

#90

Post by iso1210 »

alextheparrot wrote: post #46

My mother was raving about the service the other day. Speeds are 10-15x faster, she’s having an easier time with her online community college course and her job KPI is up by double digit percents [1]. She was worried that IT wouldn’t be OK with it when I said it was satellite (They’d been burned too many times), but the IT guy was incredibly excited because he’s also waiting to get Starlink. Looking forward to the se…

Any issues with snow etc?
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