Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision • Hacker News Board

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#101

Post by coffeefirst » Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 5:29 PM UTC

jimmaswell wrote: post #28

Politicians like these are why innovation is so slow. Google was primed and ready to try something new but it was just too different for these people to handle. I don't even like every aspect of the Google city plan but it would have been an invaluable experiment.

Ever notice that for every problem, Google's first answer is 1. big data, 2. apply AI?

I don't even mean to be snarky. If you're a hammer company full of hammer experts, you're going to see a lot of nails.

One of the interesting city planning concepts I've seen is to build the houses with their backs to the roads. You still have a place for cars/deliveries/logistics, but it also forms a walkable neighborhood that's designed for people. I've seen some small developments based on this--it feels like a big park, and the only real side effect was the coffee shop needed a second public facing door.

There's lots of cool stuff from architects and material scientists that's worth building, but the longer I work in software, the more I'm convinced that sometimes we should look at a thing and conclude we are not the most qualified people to improve it.

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#102

Post by u678u » Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 5:31 PM UTC

rubyist5eva wrote: post #14

As someone that lives in Toronto and is moving out in the middle of the month to go back home near family. The idea that Toronto is going to focus on "affordability" is laughable. It's one of the most expensive cities to live in in the world, and the incompetent city council, mayor and all the way up to the provincial government are doing absolutely everything they can to keep it that way - mostly without even realiz…

> I am not joking when I say that when the Canadian real estate markets crash - it is going to be absolutely disastrous for this country

Sounds like half the world right now.

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#103

Post by cperciva » Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 5:33 PM UTC

When politicians say "people-centred vision", they really mean "lobbyist and special interest group centred vision". To them, "people" just means "whoever shouts the loudest".

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#104

Post by logifail » Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 5:33 PM UTC

routerl wrote: post #93

logifail wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Q: Is there any kind of open market in moorings? If a normal restaurant gets threatened with a big rent hike, they can close at one location and open up somewhere else. Does that approach work if you're effectively renting your location from the Port Authority?

Of course it does. There are many, many cities by the water. Oh, his boat couldn't be moved? Is that somehow an imposition on him by the city, or simply lack of forethought? This guy put his own back against a wall.

> There are many, many cities by the water

I had kind of assumed that if you have to move, one would typically aim to move within one city - if you are trying to keep your customers, that is...

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#105

Post by u678u » Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 5:34 PM UTC

Jemm wrote: post #3

All this talk about the area and no mention that the land in that area is full of toxic pollution from decades of industrial abuse.

I live on an area that was toxic wasteland. Its just paved over and lots of condos built, full of families. Its like living in a shopping mall, you're so removed from the dirt it isn't really an issue.

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#106

Post by u678u » Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 5:36 PM UTC

Vancouver and Toronto really suffer because they're the warmest parts of a huge cold country and everyone wants to live there. Maybe global warming will mean more people will want to live further North or inland. Ideally the government would try harder like not tax people who live in smaller cities.

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#107

Post by Terretta » Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 5:41 PM UTC

kitcar wrote: post #54

andi999 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"A down payment on a Toronto house should take 24 years to accumulate", reading the article this seems to be based on a severe case of dyscalculia. If the apartment costs 1 million and you want to save until you have 6% (which is 60k), and you only save 10% of your annual 170k salary, meaning you save 17k per year so after 3 years plus you have the down-payment. In addition to proper math one also should probably sav…

If you're saving using after-tax dollars, savings 10% of 170K top line is therefore not $17K. For interest, according to https://turbotax.intuit.ca/tax-resources/canada-income-tax-c... net on $170K is $111,547, meaning closer to $11K / year

So, 23 years instead of 24? Or 3.5 years instead of 3? Your correction without conclusion doesn’t seem helpful in deciding which calculation is least wrong.

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#108

Post by alexashka » Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 5:42 PM UTC

hourislate wrote: post #27

rubyist5eva wrote: post #14

As someone that lives in Toronto and is moving out in the middle of the month to go back home near family. The idea that Toronto is going to focus on "affordability" is laughable. It's one of the most expensive cities to live in in the world, and the incompetent city council, mayor and all the way up to the provincial government are doing absolutely everything they can to keep it that way - mostly without even realiz…

The Fed Gov and BoC have no choice but to keep interest rates at zero and continue to play with numbers to keep the ponzi going so the whole Country doesn't collapse. You also have to take into consideration that there is no where else to find any work but in the big cities. The whole damn situation is a mess with no way out. Feel sorry for the kids who finish a degree in STEM from Waterloo or UoT and end up working…

> The whole damn situation is a mess with no way out.

I think there are definitely ways out, just not ones that please everyone involved.

I for one don't even understand what Toronto as a city does (I've lived here for 20+ years).

What valuable services does Toronto provide? I see bank skyscrapers downtown, some tourist attractions and a whole lot of people sitting in offices that need not be downtown, doing dubious work that largely need not be done or that can be automated with a bit of effort.

Am I way off here? For me, it's not just real estate that's gone mad, it's the world economy that enables this crazy existence of cities that produce nothing and yet millions of people live in them.

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#109

Post by PoignardAzur » Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 5:48 PM UTC

thepasswordis wrote: post #72

rubyist5eva wrote: post #14

As someone that lives in Toronto and is moving out in the middle of the month to go back home near family. The idea that Toronto is going to focus on "affordability" is laughable. It's one of the most expensive cities to live in in the world, and the incompetent city council, mayor and all the way up to the provincial government are doing absolutely everything they can to keep it that way - mostly without even realiz…

Are there any cities where the citizens don’t think the city council, government, etc is all “incompetent”? Like what is a city which is well functioning, where the citizens like the government?

The mayor of Paris (Anne Hidalgo) is relatively popular and respected by even her detractors.

(not many members of the Socialist Party you can say that about these days)

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#110

Post by f6v » Sat, Mar 13, 2021, 5:49 PM UTC

rubyist5eva wrote: post #14

As someone that lives in Toronto and is moving out in the middle of the month to go back home near family. The idea that Toronto is going to focus on "affordability" is laughable. It's one of the most expensive cities to live in in the world, and the incompetent city council, mayor and all the way up to the provincial government are doing absolutely everything they can to keep it that way - mostly without even realiz…

Canada is a democracy though. If what you’re saying is true, why won’t residents elect a government that can do something?