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Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

theguardian.com

51–60 of 217 posts

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#51

Pet peeve, articles that use "untested" as a critism when testing something is the point.

It may be the point for Google, but not for Toronto citizens, who surely want a better city more than they want to be a science experiment. I'd say the usage is purposeful and correct.

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#52
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Fed Gov and BoC have no choice but to keep interest rates at zero and continue to play with numbers to keep the ponzi going so the whole Country doesn't collapse. You also have to take into consideration that there is no where else to find any work but in the big cities. The whole damn situation is a mess with no way out. Feel sorry for the kids who finish a degree in STEM from Waterloo or UoT and end up working…

"A down payment on a Toronto house should take 24 years to accumulate", reading the article this seems to be based on a severe case of dyscalculia. If the apartment costs 1 million and you want to save until you have 6% (which is 60k), and you only save 10% of your annual 170k salary, meaning you save 17k per year so after 3 years plus you have the down-payment. In addition to proper math one also should probably sav…

I understand what your saying and it would be correct if prices were stable. The problem is that prices increase so rapidly and there is severe stagnation in salaries that you can't keep up. In OCT 2019 a Condo in a CO-OP I was looking at was selling for 350k. By Jan 2020 they were selling for 500k. It is not unusual for your 1-2 million dollar house to go up by 10-20 % a year.

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#53

As someone that lives in Toronto and is moving out in the middle of the month to go back home near family. The idea that Toronto is going to focus on "affordability" is laughable. It's one of the most expensive cities to live in in the world, and the incompetent city council, mayor and all the way up to the provincial government are doing absolutely everything they can to keep it that way - mostly without even realiz…

Don't worry, conservatives will get in and fire-sale our natural resources to try and pay off the debt. It's like a horrifying good cop bad cop.

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#54
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Fed Gov and BoC have no choice but to keep interest rates at zero and continue to play with numbers to keep the ponzi going so the whole Country doesn't collapse. You also have to take into consideration that there is no where else to find any work but in the big cities. The whole damn situation is a mess with no way out. Feel sorry for the kids who finish a degree in STEM from Waterloo or UoT and end up working…

"A down payment on a Toronto house should take 24 years to accumulate", reading the article this seems to be based on a severe case of dyscalculia. If the apartment costs 1 million and you want to save until you have 6% (which is 60k), and you only save 10% of your annual 170k salary, meaning you save 17k per year so after 3 years plus you have the down-payment. In addition to proper math one also should probably sav…

If you're saving using after-tax dollars, savings 10% of 170K top line is therefore not $17K.

For interest, according to https://turbotax.intuit.ca/tax-resources/canada-income-tax-c... net on $170K is $111,547, meaning closer to $11K / year

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#55
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is Waterfront Toronto’s actual mandate, clean up the land, build the infrastructure, sell it to developers aligned to the vision. Instead they got all whimsical and got the idea in their heads that they are going to change the world. Fooled by the FAANG. They need to get back to their knitting, not become social justice eco-warriors. Otherwise this whole project will fail and we will end up with a damned casino…

Ironically Toronto already had a floating restaurant called Captain Jacks. At the base of Yonge St. The Port Authority and the Owner could not come to an agreement on money owned for use of the slip. The owner packed in after a good run for a couple of decades. The vintage ship was towed away, and hacked up for scrap. Toronto was left without a good restaurant on the water.

It's hilarious for me to see

> Toronto was left without a good restaurant on the water

which should actually be

> The business owner was either unwilling or incapable of making his business succeed.

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#56

As someone that lives in Toronto and is moving out in the middle of the month to go back home near family. The idea that Toronto is going to focus on "affordability" is laughable. It's one of the most expensive cities to live in in the world, and the incompetent city council, mayor and all the way up to the provincial government are doing absolutely everything they can to keep it that way - mostly without even realiz…

>>It's one of the most expensive cities to live in in the world, [...]

Toronto was ranked as the 98th most expensive city in the world; not even in the top 50, even though it's the 4th largest city in North America.

Perhaps it's more accurate to say that Toronto and Vancouver are unaffordable and expensive cities for domestic Canadians to live in.

>>Our debt to GDP is out of control. Our federal government keeps borrowing and spending on things that are completely inneffective (and bragging they spent the most than any other country). My gloom and doom prediction is our currency is going to be absolutely worthless in two years time.

Canada's debt-to-GDP is 88%[2], but the USA's debt-to-GDP is 127%[3] and climbing. You remember the ol' saying: when America sneezes, Canada catches a cold. The largest destabilizing factor to Canada's economy is likely to be problems with their largest trading partner.

[1] https://www.mercer.com/newsroom/2020-cost-of-living.html

[2] https://worldpopulationreview.com/countries/countries-by-nat...

[3] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GFDEGDQ188S

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#57

Pet peeve, articles that use "untested" as a critism when testing something is the point.

The point is to improve our city and its residents' quality of life, actually.

Edit for clarity: This was a project _of the city of Toronto_. It is _only incidentally_ an Alphabet project _as well_. The City of Toronto has no fiduciary obligation to Alphabet's shareholders.

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#58

Politicians like these are why innovation is so slow. Google was primed and ready to try something new but it was just too different for these people to handle. I don't even like every aspect of the Google city plan but it would have been an invaluable experiment.

Just like the wonderful experiments of Fordlandia, EPCOT, and Pullman? Hell, if you want to look at the broader theme of companies running entire countries, look at the mismanagement of the British East India Company.

The history of such projects rather weighs against the Google project being any better, particularly given the proclivity of many in the tech world to have the arrogance to believe that they know more about other fields than those who work in those fields.

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#59
post #37
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but failing upwards is what social justice eco-warriors do best. Just look at every city they have managed for more than a decade.

What do you mean by "failing upwards" exactly?

Not the OP, but in Europe, Ursula von der Leyen is a great example. Even though she isn't a green eco warrior, but a colorless Merkel ally. She screws up and keeps getting higher and higher positions.

Re: Toronto swaps Google-backed, not-so-smart city plans for people-centred vision

#60

As someone that lives in Toronto and is moving out in the middle of the month to go back home near family. The idea that Toronto is going to focus on "affordability" is laughable. It's one of the most expensive cities to live in in the world, and the incompetent city council, mayor and all the way up to the provincial government are doing absolutely everything they can to keep it that way - mostly without even realiz…

The Fed Gov and BoC have no choice but to keep interest rates at zero and continue to play with numbers to keep the ponzi going so the whole Country doesn't collapse. You also have to take into consideration that there is no where else to find any work but in the big cities. The whole damn situation is a mess with no way out. Feel sorry for the kids who finish a degree in STEM from Waterloo or UoT and end up working…

> You also have to take into consideration that there is no where else to find any work but in the big cities.

Where does that idea come from? Even before COVID-19 the job data was indicating that the hottest job markets were in (certain) small town/rural areas and that gap widened further once COVID-19 hit. The big city, especially Toronto with it being on lockdown for many months now, is where you're more likely to struggle to find work.

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