Dead of agriculture in general happened to undeveloped countries like the one I am from a long time ago. You might not see it now but the next logical thing to happen is starvation of mass population, and a state of irrecoverable workforce, many of us around the world are doing the same, leaving the farms to go working on computers. Let me tell you this: you cannot eat bytes.
On the death of my family's dairy farm (2019)
121–130 of 341 posts
Re: On the death of my family's dairy farm (2019)
#122Earlier quoted context omitted.
You can have cooperation without price-fixing.
What would you be cooperating to do?
can't speak for gruez, but a couple off the top of my head:
-set standards that all members abide by, potentially bypassing "tragedy of the commons'-style coordination problems
-share information which, in a more cutthroat environment, would be considered "trade secrets".
Not sure how these would apply to the dairy industry specifically; it just seems overly broad to say that price fixing is the only plausible form of cooperation.
Re: On the death of my family's dairy farm (2019)
#123Earlier quoted context omitted.
> the conditions under which bull calfs for veal production is abhorrent To you! To me (also vegan) any animal in a cage is abhorrent. I want to be free and wild and I also want all others to be free and wild. Maybe some humans deserve to be caged for their behavior. Animals can never be guilty... > Next time you see that on the menu, take a moment to think about where it's coming from and how it's made. Exactly. Was…
This is yet more the kind of nonsensical, insufferable drivel that turns people away from rationally thinking about their food. Someone's preference for how and what they eat contributes nothing to conversation, and exists only to project a belief of superiority and collect pats on the back from like-minded thinkers.
> Someone's preference
It's not a personal choice (preference) when it cause another being to suffer (caged, artificially inseminated (raped), babies taken away, fed horrible food, etc.)
Thinking that it IS a personal choice, to me, puts one on borderline insanity: total disdain for other forms of sentient life.
I hope the taste of that meat/dairy/eggs makes it all worth it for you. I cannot imagine taste bud pleasure trumps ethics.
Re: On the death of my family's dairy farm (2019)
#124unfortunately the cow seems out of the barn for reasons other than legislation being missing. Farmers have not adapted to changes in conditions and they had time to do so. The point of a union should not be to collute to raise prices. The point of a union should be to pool market power and resources to break monopolies in creameries, or pollution. Any farmer should have seen the writing on the wall to have 1 creamery…
Agriculture was the first victim of the red/blue phenomenon. Agricultural and trade policy is all about government supported grain industry. For the dairy farmer, they are stuck between regulatory reform that dramatically increases the supply of milk by creating a national market, while their downstream supply chain partners are allowed to consolidate and form monopolies, because American legal theory is insane. I li…
> The aquifers that support Midwest grain are being depleted
An overwhelming majority of farm land in the Midwest is not irrigated, with Nebraska being the only significant outlier.
Re: On the death of my family's dairy farm (2019)
#125There used to be a time when every town had a dairy and also nice men who would deliver it to you in glass reusable containers and perhaps even have sex with your wife.
Re: On the death of my family's dairy farm (2019)
#126unfortunately the cow seems out of the barn for reasons other than legislation being missing. Farmers have not adapted to changes in conditions and they had time to do so. The point of a union should not be to collute to raise prices. The point of a union should be to pool market power and resources to break monopolies in creameries, or pollution. Any farmer should have seen the writing on the wall to have 1 creamery…
Agriculture was the first victim of the red/blue phenomenon. Agricultural and trade policy is all about government supported grain industry. For the dairy farmer, they are stuck between regulatory reform that dramatically increases the supply of milk by creating a national market, while their downstream supply chain partners are allowed to consolidate and form monopolies, because American legal theory is insane. I li…
> In the meantime, the well-watered, prime farm I worked on as a teen had most of the topsoil stripped and sold, and there is a subdivision with 40-50 houses on it.
Americans are addicted to (boring) houses in the suburbs and cars, it's such a shame.
Re: On the death of my family's dairy farm (2019)
#127Farming as a business gets idealized in the US and there's often this concept of a good old days when family farming was profitable and stable. But historically speaking farming has always been a boom and bust industry. Even during the land rush days in the US the amount of space granted per farm was barely enough / not enough to scrape by, even at that time. Now everything is so heavily tied up with legislation to t…
Yes, if you compare farmers with actors, they seem to have similar problems with stability of employment, low pay, and hard working conditions. In both cases these are partly caused by unavoidable factors about the industry, partly caused by ruthless suppliers, customers, investors and so on, partly caused (let's be honest) by the fact that many people make a lifestyle choice to do those professions, and will put up with poor conditions to keep on doing so.
However, we constantly hear about the rough deal farmers are getting and how important it is to do something to help them. And we never hear this about actors.
Re: On the death of my family's dairy farm (2019)
#128Earlier quoted context omitted.
That’s fair, but two posits (1) you can’t really get high quality food outside a lot of sourcing and effort. As an example, I grow purple green beans that taste better than any green bean I’ve every bought. You may be able to get that particular green bean from a specialty shop, but I’m doing this with 30 different plants on 1-2 acres. I can harvest and eat the plants the same day as well (which has far more nutritio…
I'm in a fairly similar situation, albeit on a smaller scale (6 acres) and I do this for reasons you already mentioned (nutrition, inflation hedge) plus climate change. I have years of experience growing veggies in my backyard and I agree, it takes a lot of money to get the same quality food elsewhere, and some specialties are out of reach. It's also a lot of fun. I'm also planning for retirement in the 2030s and I'm…
Frankly, while I've bailed hay, grown my own food, etc. I'm also unfamiliar with this scale - just decided to go for it.
I already have someone willing to harvest for me and split the profits 50/50. I'm offering them a 30(me)/70(them) split on the condition they teach me to run their equipment, explain what they know, etc. There's not really a guide on starting a farm, you need to find someone who knows and work with them.
I also have family members in the cattle industry, construction and one family member specializing in maintaining prairie land. Speaking with them I am working to figure out the best way to maintain and improve the farm. For instance, I have a cabin on the property from the civil war period; we're going to repair it and put a new roof on etc.
Re: On the death of my family's dairy farm (2019)
#129Earlier quoted context omitted.
That’s literally the cost I just paid lol But yes, $500k is about the minimum. Plus ~40 acres. For grass fed beef you can raise probably 20 heads and buy supplementals. You might only make $5-10k up to maybe $30k (buying hay or leasing other land to grow feed) profit initially. BUT it’s not a ton of work, really only feeding the cattle every other day, doing injections on the cattle and cutting / bailing hay 2-3 time…
>Another important factor for me, was the protection from inflation. Food prices go up during inflation, so my farm is worth more. this is a moot point because literally any other thing you invest it (short of maybe government bonds) protect you from inflation.
The other inflating asset is the $500k real estate. Here in the midwest, 40-acre farms a few dozen miles away from cities are constantly being converted into 40-unit residential housing complexes that sell at $500k/unit. Zillow and comps in my neighborhood say that my 50-year-old suburban ranch, which I bought 5 years ago, is worth more than double what I paid for it.
Buy the farm at $500k, sell it for $1M in a few years to another farmer or a developer, and you'd make double the profit of the cow farm itself. Or spend $200/square (which is itself insane) to build houses on it for a total of $24M and, if current trends continue, sell them all at $1M each for $16M profit.
With that insane real estate market status, the cows and lumber at $60k/year are almost a moo point. It's like a cow's opinion, you know, it just doesn't matter. It's "moo".
Not that the current real estate bubble isn't guaranteed not to pop. But there are a lot of powerful people and institutions which are highly incentivized to pretend it's not a bubble and make every effort to keep it from popping, so I think it's unlikely to do so.
Re: On the death of my family's dairy farm (2019)
#130Earlier quoted context omitted.
I guess I was speaking more generally but as far as livestock there's certainly plenty if idolizing that too, even if some don't.
Stinking animals, caged or fenced up, slaughter looming over their pitiful existence. Nope. No glamour there as far as i see.
Your distaste for it really doesn't have much to do with if it is or isn't idealized.