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How Big Tech Is Importing India’s Caste Legacy to Silicon Valley

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Re: How Big Tech Is Importing India’s Caste Legacy to Silicon Valley

#31

Post by ramraj07 »

doggodaddo78 wrote: post #4

Who's worked with Brahmin IITians, raise a paw? :paw emoji here: I hope the Valley absorbs all of the world's horrible tech sociological antipatterns because I ejected from that heap. Transient gold miners descended on the place where I grew up, treated it disposably, and failed to make any effort to integrate because they're just visiting to make their coin. Sunnyvale Costco is like an airport in Burma (okay, Myanma…

I’m neither Brahmin nor IITian but am in the immediately adjacent category of Indians. Are many of these IIT alumni (and others as well) from India basically rednecks with engineering degrees? Probably yes. Does it mean your “learn the language” attitude is actually relevant to this discussion? Probably not. Guess who else tells me, a Tamil guy, to learn the language? The same IITians (Hindi is the most popular language in India). So if you were born in New Delhi in a Brahmin Family you’d probably be doing in Cisco and Costco exactly what you blame these immigrants of doing.

The fundamental flaw in humanity seems to be this absolute belief that they are the good guy and everyone else is the bad guy. Self reflection will reveal that we all live in the same spectrum of shittiness just coming in different flavours given circumstances.

Re: How Big Tech Is Importing India’s Caste Legacy to Silicon Valley

#32

Post by doggodaddo78 »

devoutsalsa wrote: post #13
ricardobayes wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, there is at least gold where you grew up. Lots of other areas have gone through the same transformation without the 'gold'. For example where I live is a touristic part of Spain. It wasn't touristic at all 40 years ago, so much so that people washed their clothes in the river (not joking). Come mass tourism they abandoned everything and erected megahotels. But tourists priced locals out, nobody can afford housi…

I was just in Playa Del Carmen, Mexico. Everything was geared towards grabbing those tourist dollars. Nice place to visit, but I wouldn’t want to live there. I’d feel a little better about it if the tourist cash stayed with the locals, but I don’t suspect it does. It’s like displace local culture with tourist culture, and pray the tourists keep coming.

Everyone hates a tourist but loves their money. It's a universal law.

Re: How Big Tech Is Importing India’s Caste Legacy to Silicon Valley

#33

Post by OliverJones »

A story. A few years back I worked with an Indian team of developers and testers. They did a great job. Their lead was an IIT graduate. They have two managing partners; one is a secular Hindu and the other a practicing Muslim. Multicultural they are.

I went to visit them once. (Always a good idea to personally get to know people who work on your stuff!) They're in Odisha, in the east of India.

I asked the group, over lunch, about the caste system. Everybody agreed that it was a thing of the past and a historical shame.

But, later, each team member found a private way to tell me they came from Brahmin (top caste) families. It was really interesting to see how it played out.

Is it possible that human nature relentlessly drives us to this sort of tribalism? It shows up as racism in the western hemisphere, the caste system in India, the class system in England and their former colonies, and so forth.

At any rate, resisting this tribalism is hard work. But do that work we must. It's helpful to this westerner to learn about the caste system. I suppose it's equally helpful to people from India to learn about American racism.

Re: How Big Tech Is Importing India’s Caste Legacy to Silicon Valley

#34

Post by eplanit »

devoutsalsa wrote: post #13
ricardobayes wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, there is at least gold where you grew up. Lots of other areas have gone through the same transformation without the 'gold'. For example where I live is a touristic part of Spain. It wasn't touristic at all 40 years ago, so much so that people washed their clothes in the river (not joking). Come mass tourism they abandoned everything and erected megahotels. But tourists priced locals out, nobody can afford housi…

I was just in Playa Del Carmen, Mexico. Everything was geared towards grabbing those tourist dollars. Nice place to visit, but I wouldn’t want to live there. I’d feel a little better about it if the tourist cash stayed with the locals, but I don’t suspect it does. It’s like displace local culture with tourist culture, and pray the tourists keep coming.

It's the same everywhere, I guess. I lived in Sausalito for 14 years, and can attest that that is exactly what a "tourist town" is/becomes, by design.

Re: How Big Tech Is Importing India’s Caste Legacy to Silicon Valley

#36

Post by marcinzm »

holistio wrote: post #15
doggodaddo78 wrote: post #4

Who's worked with Brahmin IITians, raise a paw? :paw emoji here: I hope the Valley absorbs all of the world's horrible tech sociological antipatterns because I ejected from that heap. Transient gold miners descended on the place where I grew up, treated it disposably, and failed to make any effort to integrate because they're just visiting to make their coin. Sunnyvale Costco is like an airport in Burma (okay, Myanma…

Also, I noticed some commenters make harsh and hateful generalisations about people they do not actually know. Sigh. This comment above made me a bit sad.

Yeah, it reads to me like the usual age old generalizations of "I don't dislike group X but they're just dirty slobs with no manners, not their fault of course, but they are that."

Re: How Big Tech Is Importing India’s Caste Legacy to Silicon Valley

#37

Post by doggodaddo78 »

mc32 wrote: post #22
doggodaddo78 wrote: post #4

Who's worked with Brahmin IITians, raise a paw? :paw emoji here: I hope the Valley absorbs all of the world's horrible tech sociological antipatterns because I ejected from that heap. Transient gold miners descended on the place where I grew up, treated it disposably, and failed to make any effort to integrate because they're just visiting to make their coin. Sunnyvale Costco is like an airport in Burma (okay, Myanma…

A contributor to the attitude is the caste itself. These kids (huge majority from upper castes) are treated with too much deference at home by the parents, family and society. Since they are served well at home by servants and society when they go to foreign lands their expectations don’t change and they take the baggage with them. Mind you, they’re modulating the behavior a bit abroad because at home it’s even more…

I worked with a dude at a Pac12 who expected rides home because he didn't have a car. I quit after he derisively referred to my friend and his attitude become intolerably obnoxious. This is what happens when someone is raised with 40 servants, becomes a stock broker, and then decides to dabble in medical academia instead. Treat kids like royalty and they will act like they're innately special and deserving more than others do.

Re: How Big Tech Is Importing India’s Caste Legacy to Silicon Valley

#38

Post by lhorie »

doggodaddo78 wrote: post #24
lhorie wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry but consider that this right here is discrimination too. Go to Costco in Markham, Ontario and you're going to be seeing a lot of chinese people in the way you describe too. But then consider: when was the last time you stepped into your local hmart (a Korean supermarket chain)? People congregate with similar people. This is something torontonians have gotten over ages ago. Mingle if you want to, but also ac…

NIMBY is for nuclear reactors, not groups of people who Balkanize themselves into their own gated communities, whether native or immigrants.

Come on now, if you're gonna be pulling the "I lived here 40 years" card, at least acknowledge issues like affordable housing and tech hating graffiti.

Re: How Big Tech Is Importing India’s Caste Legacy to Silicon Valley

#39

Post by majjgepolja »

mc32 wrote: post #22
doggodaddo78 wrote: post #4

Who's worked with Brahmin IITians, raise a paw? :paw emoji here: I hope the Valley absorbs all of the world's horrible tech sociological antipatterns because I ejected from that heap. Transient gold miners descended on the place where I grew up, treated it disposably, and failed to make any effort to integrate because they're just visiting to make their coin. Sunnyvale Costco is like an airport in Burma (okay, Myanma…

A contributor to the attitude is the caste itself. These kids (huge majority from upper castes) are treated with too much deference at home by the parents, family and society. Since they are served well at home by servants and society when they go to foreign lands their expectations don’t change and they take the baggage with them. Mind you, they’re modulating the behavior a bit abroad because at home it’s even more…

> These kids (huge majority from upper castes) are treated with too much deference at home by the parents, family and society. Since they are served well at home by servants ...

Do not know which area you are from. But in practice most of the traditional "Upper caste" people are not rich enough for having servants. Their air of superiority comes from mere name of the caste and tribal feeling, but upper caste people will be dime a dozen in any given area and grow up like middle class kids.

Re: How Big Tech Is Importing India’s Caste Legacy to Silicon Valley

#40

Post by cmdshiftf4 »

>This is something torontonians have gotten over ages ago.

Bad example. Canada is a globalist punching bag and their behaviour isn't indicative of a country that has grown but one that has merely submitted.

I lived in Toronto for a couple of years and even at that point most of the people I met who were born and bred there were hauling ass out of the city to places like Barrie, Burlington or other provinces entirely. What's left is a city full of people with little ties to the place and with little in common beyond being "fans" of manufactured "Canadian" MLSE teams and a love for consuming mainly American media, American brands and American social issues. It's a soulless husk of a city and one that should serve as an example to others of what not to let your home descend to.

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