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Let’s redesign the laptop for a work-from-home era

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Re: Let’s redesign the laptop for a work-from-home era

#131

Post by ClumsyPilot »

viklove wrote: post #38
brmgb wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are completely missing the point (it feels like I am now posting this everyday on HN). No one is asking for a Blue Snowball mic and Logitech webcam in their laptop. People are rightfully wondering why in world a ubiquous small competent cameras (see every iPhone from the past decades) and mic, the ones laptops are using are so poor. The answer is most likely because no one cared so I fully expect that to change b…

The answer is very simple: the display of your laptop is much thinner than your phone. So if you want something better, you will need to use an external camera.

Or we need the thing designed by people who don't have their head up their rear. Have you seen the dell XPS with a nosecam? When I got my computer and realised what they've done, i thought the management must have been on crack!

Re: Let’s redesign the laptop for a work-from-home era

#132

Post by emkoemko »

svachalek wrote: post #50
hombre_fatal wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d be surprised if even most people agree with you that the best computer is a static one tethered to a desk, even if they never leave their home. Gamers aside. I built a desktop computer and never use it. Having to sit in the same desk just to use it is a nearly insurmountable drawback. It’s more of a niche appliance than we admit. I’d suspect most people with the option would need more than a better deal on compon…

The ergonomics of using a laptop 8 hours a day are pretty horrendous. It may be hard to notice in your 20s but it will wreck your body. Using a proper desk and desk chair, or sit/stand desk, will save a lot of wear and tear.

yes, i don't understand how people don't notice this... forcing a keyboard to be right up against a screen is not a good idea. Most people don't even need a laptop or use it on a desk mostly anyways, at that point just get a monitor and keyboard/mouse and use it as a desktop and then when you really need to do some remote work you still can.

Re: Let’s redesign the laptop for a work-from-home era

#133

Post by emkoemko »

ArkanExplorer wrote: post #69
podiki wrote: post #7

I don't really understand the point of this article as "redesigning the laptop." Nearly all of the things they mention is either software (e.g. better processing of mic input) or called a desktop (screens, noise, etc.). If people are working from home that negates a big reason for the laptop: portability. Sure it is nice to move to the couch or kitchen or whatever, but maybe that could be having a keyboard and using…

You don't need a desktop - you just need a monitor arm, two monitors, and a good keyboard and mouse.

yea that's a good option, that way you won't damage your body and for short amount of time you can still use your laptop but you should limit it.

Re: Let’s redesign the laptop for a work-from-home era

#134

Post by uncledave »

draklor40 wrote: post #94

There exists a good solution. It is called a desktop. I turned my company provided laptop into an almost full desktop with external monitor, keyboard and mouse, speakers, a USB microphone, USB camera. At this point I am wondering why do I even have a wimpy ULV processor to write code 8 hrs a day. The sheer amount of time I could save by switching to even a basic 4 core 45-65w Desktop class CPU. Saving pennies on the…

I’m with you on this.

I’ve been working remotely for many years now and I started using laptops initially (thinkpad T series ) so my house didn’t get cluttered with work things mostly and I could waltz into the office. Roll on time and I discovered that laptops are a complete nightmare and I am never using one again.

They are expensive, hot, slow, noisy, fragile, have poor connectivity options, needy, unreliable and terrible for your health.

Also there is no office now thanks to covid so I now work from one location always.

The expensive XPS I’ve just been shipped by my company is another one which persists these problems further. It will never be used as a laptop but as a desktop and a wart I can’t get rid of.

I would be happier with a recycled corp i5 desktop with 32gb of ram and 500gb SSD.

Edit to add that my personal computer is a M1 Mac mini. I include MacBooks in my list of criticism, including the M1 units. I have had numerous really bad experiences with Apple laptops.

Re: Let’s redesign the laptop for a work-from-home era

#135

Post by emkoemko »

mullingitover wrote: post #81
podiki wrote: post #7

I don't really understand the point of this article as "redesigning the laptop." Nearly all of the things they mention is either software (e.g. better processing of mic input) or called a desktop (screens, noise, etc.). If people are working from home that negates a big reason for the laptop: portability. Sure it is nice to move to the couch or kitchen or whatever, but maybe that could be having a keyboard and using…

> Or if you are working from home nearly all the time, a desktop will be a better and more economical choice. If I'm not doing something that requires huge wattage, the only thing a desktop computer does is to force me to sit at a desk 100% of the time I'm using it. Hard pass. Tablets are nearly all toys, and the ones that aren't weigh more and cost more than a good laptop (but with a cumbersome UI). If you want to s…

"desktop computer does is to force me to sit at a desk 100% of the time I'm using it" you act like that's a bad thing... when its really the best way to use a computer for large amount of time. Laptops should never be used for long periods unless you want to damage your back and neck.

Re: Let’s redesign the laptop for a work-from-home era

#136

Post by masswerk »

Some things I could think of, regarding the general form factor and basic ergonomics:

* detachable keyboard (the Olivetti M15 managed this quite well in 1987, compare [1], [2] -- also mind the full-travel keys)

* height adjustable screen (e.g., using an arresting sliding mechanism)

With powerful while minimalistic hardware around, like the M1 chip, we may start to think about the convertible laptop the other way round again. (I.e. the folding workstation as opposed to tablet-like dual use. As the hardware becomes minimalistic, this also provides space for any mechanisms that may provide for basic ergonomic requirements.) Why are we still accepting cowering like this in front of what has become the dominant form factor for a computer as the general posture of work?

[1] https://www.homecomputermuseum.de/sammlung/detailansicht/com...

[2] https://www.flickr.com/photos/simo_81/8151480380

PS: Adjusting the viewing angle would also solve any webcam issues quite naturally.

Re: Let’s redesign the laptop for a work-from-home era

#137

Post by tpmx »

dont__panic wrote: post #104
jaywalk wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not everyone who wears glasses wants to stop wearing them.

Though admittedly wearing a mask during the winter time has made me consider it much more than usual this year.

An unexpected bonus with lenses: Superhuman tolerance against eyes getting irritated when chopping onions.

Re: Let’s redesign the laptop for a work-from-home era

#138

Post by Const-me »

toast0 wrote: post #71
freeone3000 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Laptops, by necessity, have smaller fans, since they're smaller. Same amount of cooling with a smaller fan means the fans spin faster, and faster fans are louder. Laptops simply can't have acceptable performance with adequate cooling unless you're willing to compromise on either noise, or running x86.

If you stuck the processor behind the screen, you could get a lot more airflow. Let the bottom be essentially be a battery, keyboard, mouse, and a docking station. And the lid be processor, memory, a m.2 for storage and an m.2 for wireless. Put a big, but thin fan on top of the processor and lots of venting on the side. Probably won't be very thin though.

Liquid crystals are, well, liquid. They typically list [ 0°C .. +50°C ] interval.

Even laptop CPUs are generally warmer than +50°C when loaded, the limit for various CPUs is often about +85°C .. +105°C. When you place CPU right behind LCD, it’s hard to do good thermal insulation. This means the display gonna fail soon, unless the manufacturer does aggressive thermal throttling of the CPU, like it happens in tablets.

Re: Let’s redesign the laptop for a work-from-home era

#139

Post by tmotwu »

masswerk wrote: post #136

Some things I could think of, regarding the general form factor and basic ergonomics: * detachable keyboard (the Olivetti M15 managed this quite well in 1987, compare [1], [2] -- also mind the full-travel keys) * height adjustable screen (e.g., using an arresting sliding mechanism) With powerful while minimalistic hardware around, like the M1 chip, we may start to think about the convertible laptop the other way roun…

What's wrong with the Surface Book?

Re: Let’s redesign the laptop for a work-from-home era

#140

Post by emkoemko »

nwienert wrote: post #123
dingaling wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Sometimes I just want to work while sitting comfortably on the couch. Grab some paper and a pencil and use it as non-screen time. Else you can find yourself spending too long on a poor posture on furniture that's designed for lean-back, not lean-in.

I have a minor issue with my lower spine, not crazy but actually sit at desk 0% of the time as a result. Laptops on the couch are quite cozy and sustainable.

you have spine issues so you think using a laptop is a good idea? "sustainable" no its really bad for you long term.
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