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UK 'Right to repair' law to come in this summer

bbc.co.uk

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Re: UK 'Right to repair' law to come in this summer

#51

Post by HPsquared »

ed_balls wrote: post #28
aboringusername wrote: post #9

When everything is a commodity it's hard to see how this will be useful. When an appliance (fridge, cooker, washing machine) breaks, it's cheaper to replace. I cannot see how repairing a TV will ever be cheaper than just replacing it since they are so cheap brand new. This also applies to smartphones, none of the popular models have replaceable batteries so in the trash they go and they become worthless, even if the…

> When an appliance (fridge, cooker, washing machine) breaks, it's cheaper to replace In a lot of cases it's not, but people don't want to troubleshoot or 3rd part makes more money by replacing it. I try to fix my suff not for economical reasons, but environmental. In many instances I also save time as well. A few examples: - car service wanted to replace windshield wipers on my car. I took a piece of sandpaper and c…

I agree on the time thing, if you have the inclination it's often easier/faster to just fix something, rather than all the hassle of replacing it (not even counting the monetary saving)

Re: UK 'Right to repair' law to come in this summer

#52

Post by gpderetta »

jhrozek wrote: post #39
MayeulC wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Highly skilled? I don't think so. You just have to be very careful, and pay attention to the right things (ESD, cut the power, short circuits, etc). Secondly, the diagnostic needs to be correct. Multiple faillures is unlikely if there is no external cause (surge, flooding...) or cascading failures. Both of the above points can be solved with good documentation. I've seen very good servicing manuals, this is part of t…

I think your reply shows that you are already very skilled. Other comments mentioned replacing a diode -- I know what a diode is conceptually, but I have no idea how does it look in the appliance, where would I buy a new one or how to replace it. Being as clueless as I am, my only option is to call a proffessional. Sometimes it is worth it -- I had a fan on my MacBook replaced for ~700 SEK which is a fraction of the…

If products can be repaired easily, even if it is not worth paying to repair it or one is not skilled enough to repair it, there might still be a market for broken down items as people with skills might buy them, fix them and use or resell them. It beats throwing stuff in the trash.

Re: UK 'Right to repair' law to come in this summer

#53

Post by varispeed »

MaxBarraclough wrote: post #18
dsnr wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Given how much of EU innovation is bogged down by regulatory capture, I am extremely skeptical of this (note, I know EU/UK are separated, but nevertheless, lobbying is lobbying, universally) That‘s probably how the concept of „legitimate interest“ made its way into the GDPR law, make it practically worthless, with the single upside of making people more aware of cross-site tracking. Another example of half-assed EU…

> That‘s probably how the concept of „legitimate interest“ made its way into the GDPR law, make it practically worthless Does it though? Is there case law supporting this? From what I can see the big problem with the GDPR is a near-total failure to actually enforce it, so such questions barely even matter.

As predicted only few small players were fined and the giants continue as they please. EU can tick the box and claim PR points for "solving" the problem, when in reality you got more points of data breach and people are trained to click boxes without reading.

Re: UK 'Right to repair' law to come in this summer

#54

Post by TeMPOraL »

zaarn wrote: post #50
MaxBarraclough wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That‘s probably how the concept of „legitimate interest“ made its way into the GDPR law, make it practically worthless Does it though? Is there case law supporting this? From what I can see the big problem with the GDPR is a near-total failure to actually enforce it, so such questions barely even matter.

It's mostly the Irish DPC dragging feet, from experience my own local DPC has been excellent and in one case a complaint of mine resulted in a fine. They just can't do anything about companies registered in Ireland.

Which is also where all the major offenders are, because of tax trickery. This is starting to be really annoying.

Re: UK 'Right to repair' law to come in this summer

#55

Post by TeMPOraL »

KozmoNau7 wrote: post #16
aboringusername wrote: post #13

I think any right to repair needs to solve 2 problems: 1: Fixing bad hardware (schematics and such) 2: Fixing old/buggy/broken software that renders said hardware useless. Without open kernels, drivers, frameworks your "right to repair" is meaningless. When you install a new camera to iPhone and it complains it's not genuine because the software says so, the right to repair becomes less useful as now Apple holds all…

There needs to be a clause that makes the software and other designs specifications openly available (or for some small fee, not exceeding a reasonable percentage of the product's retail price), once the product is no longer supported by the manufacturer. I.e. the manufacturer has produced a newer - presumably better - device that non-technical users will want to buy, and the old devices can be handed down to more te…

Definitely. The problem here is that manufacturers will claim that parts old of software and design specs are used in the new device, which makes them a legitimate trade secret they shouldn't be forced to reveal.

Re: UK 'Right to repair' law to come in this summer

#56

Post by zaarn »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #54
zaarn wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's mostly the Irish DPC dragging feet, from experience my own local DPC has been excellent and in one case a complaint of mine resulted in a fine. They just can't do anything about companies registered in Ireland.

Which is also where all the major offenders are, because of tax trickery. This is starting to be really annoying.

The solution would be a small amendment of the GDPR that local DPCs can take matters in their own hands if 1-2 years pass without the other DPC doing anything about a violation. (This would still be different from the other DPC finding there to be no violation).

Re: UK 'Right to repair' law to come in this summer

#57

Post by jokethrowaway »

Good luck enforcing any of this.

As for hundreds other useless regulations that bog us down.

For example, compare the warranty process with Apple and with any of the other laptop companies. If regulations worked you wouldn't even consider warranty to be a good selling point.

Still I've been burned by warranties services so many times, threatened to report, reported to consumer report and I got nothing out of it. I don't even consider it. I just buy crap I'll try to fix myself if it breaks or I buy from a reputable company.

What are the regulations doing for us then?

How many companies using dark patterns in their EU imposed cookie banners have been fined?

Re: UK 'Right to repair' law to come in this summer

#59

Post by simonh »

pabs3 wrote: post #49
aboringusername wrote: post #13

I think any right to repair needs to solve 2 problems: 1: Fixing bad hardware (schematics and such) 2: Fixing old/buggy/broken software that renders said hardware useless. Without open kernels, drivers, frameworks your "right to repair" is meaningless. When you install a new camera to iPhone and it complains it's not genuine because the software says so, the right to repair becomes less useful as now Apple holds all…

Most TVs run Linux so asking them for GPLed code should work, failing that, it is a GPL violation that should be reported to Software Freedom Conservancy, who can help bring the vendor into compliance. https://sfconservancy.org/copyleft-compliance/

A lot of them run on ARM chips, or other SOCs, so you'll be stuck trying to get hold of binary blob drivers.

Re: UK 'Right to repair' law to come in this summer

#60

Post by blub »

draklor40 wrote: post #7

Only a matter of time before they modify the Law to introduce a catch that makes it practically worthless. A - A classification system that makes defines how "easy" it is to repair something, but necessarily doesn't mean that you or I can repair it at home.It will be "easy" IF you have the right 50,000 GBP tool. B - Modify right to repair as good for the environment rule. There will be an escape clause that says that…

If everybody were such a pessimist, we'd never try to improve anything because there's a risk it might not always work or need adjustment in the future.

And a certain someone would also be there telling everyone not to go outside of the cave because there's tigers :)

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