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Why I did not go to jail (2014)

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Re: Why I did not go to jail (2014)

#61

Post by thaumasiotes »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #24
shoo wrote: post #19

Options backdating schemes allow additional wealth to be transferred to an options recipient from the company. In doing so, they increase the company's compensation expenses. The next question to ask is: are the increased compensation expenses created by options backdating clearly disclosed to the company's investors, or does the company misrepresent its compensation expenses to investors as being artificially low? W…

> Options backdating schemes allow additional wealth to be transferred to an options recipient from the company. The issue is that the company is owned by shareholders. So the wealth transfer is from shareholders, including public investors, to employees.

Sorry, what is the issue supposed to be? "The company is owned by shareholders" describes all employee compensation. (Indeed, it describes everything the company does.) Does the presence of shareholders mean we have to stop paying salaries?

Re: Why I did not go to jail (2014)

#62

Post by mr_cyborg »

jacquesm wrote: post #16

This is one of the more important bits to be periodically reposted on HN. Compliance with the law is not 'optional', and if you cross that line there is a fair chance that it will come back to bite you. Regulated industries, stock transactions (and options, as in this bit of startup history) all have their peculiarities and you need to realize that not all of these end up with the proverbial slap on the wrist if you…

> ask Martha Stewart (a billionaire) how her attempt to save $45K ended up to see why this is so

Wasn’t Martha Stewart charged with obstructing an investigation and not actually securities fraud?

Re: Why I did not go to jail (2014)

#63

Post by dang »

ChrisArchitect wrote: post #52
dang wrote: post #17

If curious, past threads: Why I Did Not Go to Jail (2014) - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18026790 - Sept 2018 (152 comments) Why I Did Not Go to Jail (2014) - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11240717 - March 2016 (13 comments) Why I Did Not Go To Jail - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7191642 - Feb 2014 (182 comments)

ya, curious why this has to be submitted over and over

Reposts are fine on HN if a story hasn't had attention in a year or more. The purpose of listing past threads is just that people might enjoy reading them.

Re: Why I did not go to jail (2014)

#64

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

ChrisArchitect wrote: post #52
dang wrote: post #17

If curious, past threads: Why I Did Not Go to Jail (2014) - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18026790 - Sept 2018 (152 comments) Why I Did Not Go to Jail (2014) - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11240717 - March 2016 (13 comments) Why I Did Not Go To Jail - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7191642 - Feb 2014 (182 comments)

ya, curious why this has to be submitted over and over

I like it.

I'd love to see something about ethics, too. I feel there is a need for more ethical behavior, in today's corporate world.

I have a fairly basic ethical litmus test: "If I feel like I can 'get away with it,' it's wrong." Doesn't matter, whether or not it's legal.

Wrong is wrong.

One of the most valuable assets in my life, is my personal sense of Integrity and Honor. It has nothing at all to do with whether or not anyone else is doing it. It's all about whether or not I can shave in the morning.

I'm clean-shaven.

Re: Why I did not go to jail (2014)

#65

Post by setpatchaddress »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #64
ChrisArchitect wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ya, curious why this has to be submitted over and over

I like it. I'd love to see something about ethics, too. I feel there is a need for more ethical behavior, in today's corporate world. I have a fairly basic ethical litmus test: "If I feel like I can 'get away with it,' it's wrong." Doesn't matter, whether or not it's legal . Wrong is wrong. One of the most valuable assets in my life, is my personal sense of Integrity and Honor. It has nothing at all to do with whethe…

You can't shave if you commit a crime? Is this a New York colloquialism?

Re: Why I did not go to jail (2014)

#67

Post by ajb »

One interesting thing is that these backdating schemes were caught out by statistics. As I understand it, at the time the regulatory regime was such that it could be arranged easily that there be no documentary evidence that backdating had occurred - options grants were made by resolution of some internal company committee and documentation of this was filed after the fact. (Not sure if this is true today?). Thus this practice came to be one that 'everybody does, and gets away with'.

But, some academics figured out that they could show statistically that options backdating was occurring: https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Raquel-Alexander/public... and very quickly it became a huge legal issue for a lot of companies.

Re: Why I did not go to jail (2014)

#68

Post by srl »

setpatchaddress wrote: post #65
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like it. I'd love to see something about ethics, too. I feel there is a need for more ethical behavior, in today's corporate world. I have a fairly basic ethical litmus test: "If I feel like I can 'get away with it,' it's wrong." Doesn't matter, whether or not it's legal . Wrong is wrong. One of the most valuable assets in my life, is my personal sense of Integrity and Honor. It has nothing at all to do with whethe…

You can't shave if you commit a crime? Is this a New York colloquialism?

I think it's a maybe-too-clever variation on "look myself in the mirror". I've never heard it before either.

Re: Why I did not go to jail (2014)

#69

Post by jacquesm »

mr_cyborg wrote: post #62
jacquesm wrote: post #16

This is one of the more important bits to be periodically reposted on HN. Compliance with the law is not 'optional', and if you cross that line there is a fair chance that it will come back to bite you. Regulated industries, stock transactions (and options, as in this bit of startup history) all have their peculiarities and you need to realize that not all of these end up with the proverbial slap on the wrist if you…

> ask Martha Stewart (a billionaire) how her attempt to save $45K ended up to see why this is so Wasn’t Martha Stewart charged with obstructing an investigation and not actually securities fraud?

That's why I added Al Capone: it isn't always what you did that you end up getting convicted for, some things are a lot easier to prove than others and why waste a lot of effort on something hard to prove when the perp conveniently hands you an easier way to achieve the same effect?

Re: Why I did not go to jail (2014)

#70

Post by jacquesm »

simonebrunozzi wrote: post #34
jacquesm wrote: post #16

This is one of the more important bits to be periodically reposted on HN. Compliance with the law is not 'optional', and if you cross that line there is a fair chance that it will come back to bite you. Regulated industries, stock transactions (and options, as in this bit of startup history) all have their peculiarities and you need to realize that not all of these end up with the proverbial slap on the wrist if you…

> If your boss tells you to do something that might land you in jail: resign. Let me make it better: resign, but also take precautions, in case after your resignation, your boss offloads some guilt to you.

Yes, good point.
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