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Bill Gates Says that Bitcoin is bad For the Planet

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Re: Bill Gates Says that Bitcoin is bad For the Planet

#441

Post by Triv888 »

saalweachter wrote: post #220
jetpackjoe wrote: post #9

There are so many better crypto-currencies. Better for the environment because they use proof-of-stake, and not proof-of-work. Better for users because transactions are confirmed in seconds, not hours, and without the ridiculous fees that Bitcoin has. I think this shows how truly powerful the network effect, and being first to market is. Because without those things, Bitcoin would be nothing.

You know what actually bothers me the most about all crypto-currencies? None of them are actually money, like in the paper-or-gold-coin sense. They're all ledgers. The thing about money is that I can hand it to someone . Possession of the money is possession of the money and third parties don't need to get involved in every transaction. I can hand someone dollars and take a sandwich and walk away, transaction done. T…

> None of them are actually money

only because the US Gov didn't classify it as money for tax purposes...

Re: Bill Gates Says that Bitcoin is bad For the Planet

#442

Post by Cookingboy »

mattwilsonn888 wrote: post #263
kitcar wrote: post #11

Bitcoin is an almost perfect exploitation of humanities fatal flaws (greed, unwillingness to acknowledge externalities - i.e. selfishness). It's that old SF-trope that the cause of many of humanity's biggest problems is humans.

Yes, and the selective bail outs and inflation which favor the rich are just the opposite!

Just because something else is bad already doesn't mean you should introduce more of the same.

Also Bill Gate's opinion is based on Bitcoin offering almost no utilitarian value but consumes a ton of energy, nothing to do with monetary policies.

Re: Bill Gates Says that Bitcoin is bad For the Planet

#443

Post by simonw »

mancerayder wrote: post #438
kitcar wrote: post #11

Bitcoin is an almost perfect exploitation of humanities fatal flaws (greed, unwillingness to acknowledge externalities - i.e. selfishness). It's that old SF-trope that the cause of many of humanity's biggest problems is humans.

Not a bitcoin fanboy, but that's a bit strong a statement. What is "greed" versus motivation for innovation? Is innovation rewarded with (taxed, regulated) wealth greed, and if so, is that "bad"? And if it creates Teslas and rockets that land, and robots on Mars that last a year or more analyzing samples, is it a fatal flaw? Some more questions... So let's say BTC is greed - the many financial instruments out there,…

SF here is Science Fiction, not San Francisco.

Re: Bill Gates Says that Bitcoin is bad For the Planet

#444

Post by Dma54rhs »

mathlover2 wrote: post #343
Shorel wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have been polluting and overheating the planet to make virtual characters eat pills and rescue princesses for over 30 years. What's the utility of that?

The amount of energy required to rescue a single princess does not increase exponentially over time. In fact it pretty much stays constant. Furthermore, gaming energy expenditures are probably minor compared to the amount spent on Bitcoin these days (last I heard it had an energy footprint equivalent to the Netherlands.) There are also other cryptocurrencies that don't have the same problem as Bitcoin with being incr…

75twh/year only PC gaming and that was year 2015! And PC gaming is smaller market. Now add the whole industry or creating them and the servers running the online parts. And add consoles. And creating all the hardware, mining minerals for them, transportation.

The industry is growing like crazy as well.

Bitcoin was 122 twh/year I believe.

Both gaming and bitcoin kill the planet and are not necessary until global warming under control.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/285396475_Taming_th...

Re: Bill Gates Says that Bitcoin is bad For the Planet

#445

Post by jedberg »

yrral wrote: post #419
jedberg wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If I launch a BTC miner into space and use a star to power it, will you worry about what else could have been done with that energy? Well first of all you used a ton of energy to get it to space. But yes, I would definitely worry about it. There are a ton of other CPU intense jobs you could do with a rig like that that would be more beneficial to humanity. Medical research for example. It doesn't matter where you d…

Why is using computing power for bitcoin not beneficial to humanity?

What benefit does it supply to humanity? I can think of plenty of uses for a distributed ledger, but what is the use of Bitcoin that can't be done some other way?

Re: Bill Gates Says that Bitcoin is bad For the Planet

#446

Post by nelsontodd »

jfim wrote: post #400
nelsontodd wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt they would just roll over yeah. If you consider the dollar as a weapon/tool for US hegemony, bitcoin functions as almost like a terrorist entity. Not clear what to do with this information

It's just a risk that the value of it drops to near zero if it's outlawed. Or it could become highly regulated and be much less useful for trade due to onerous compliance requirements. For example, how do you prove that wallet X that one is sending money to isn't going to someone who's in an embargoed country?

It's a big risk. But, to answer your second question, its a public ledger. Its significantly more conducive to surveillance than cash. Just punish people if they send money to an unverified address.

I think that's a gross possibility, and I hope no governments take this measure, but I don't think it would be difficult.

Re: Bill Gates Says that Bitcoin is bad For the Planet

#447

Post by devmunchies »

gnrlst wrote: post #143
wbobeirne wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What defines a currency being "better" than another? Is it number of transactions? Is it acceptance among merchants? Is it low fees? Is it stability in purchasing power? Is it likelihood that there will be a fatal flaw in the system that causes financial loss? Every project has its own strengths and weaknesses, but it's hard to argue that Bitcoin isn't the best on many of those measures. It's all about which of them…

All the features mentioned above. For example: - transaction times - energy consumption - scalability (BTC currently does 7tx/s) - security (BTC is getting more centralized over time, increasing the risk of a majority takeover.) - fewer fees as possible (ideally 0) BTC only has first mover advantage, and security...for now.

another is privacy. Bitcoin is not private.

Monero is exclusively private and ZCash is opt-in private.

Re: Bill Gates Says that Bitcoin is bad For the Planet

#448

Post by ravenstine »

meddlepal wrote: post #58

What is up with the comments in this thread? Feels like tons of them are bot written. Weird attacks on Bill Gates and Microsoft all over the place.

Maybe that's because no one should blindly trust a billionaire's opinion on a form of economics. Same goes for Elon Musk, who's on the opposite end of Bill Gates on BTC. It shouldn't be surprising that Bill Gates, Peter Schiff, and so forth might find BTC to be a threat to at least some of their wealth. (as an example, if cryptocurrency somehow evened the playing field for people to build up their wealth, that's not good for the Meanwhile, we've got many people(and many of whom I think are extremely hypocritical) piling on the BTC hate mob and using Bill Gates to feed into their viewpoint. Gates is a smart man, but I don't think it's reasonable to believe that his opinion on BTC is worth much more than someone whose net worth is a minuscule fraction of his.

Re: Bill Gates Says that Bitcoin is bad For the Planet

#449

Post by mancerayder »

simonw wrote: post #443
mancerayder wrote: post #438

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not a bitcoin fanboy, but that's a bit strong a statement. What is "greed" versus motivation for innovation? Is innovation rewarded with (taxed, regulated) wealth greed, and if so, is that "bad"? And if it creates Teslas and rockets that land, and robots on Mars that last a year or more analyzing samples, is it a fatal flaw? Some more questions... So let's say BTC is greed - the many financial instruments out there,…

SF here is Science Fiction, not San Francisco.

I stand corrected, but I like the accidental pun.

Re: Bill Gates Says that Bitcoin is bad For the Planet

#450

Post by thatcat »

kitcar wrote: post #11

Bitcoin is an almost perfect exploitation of humanities fatal flaws (greed, unwillingness to acknowledge externalities - i.e. selfishness). It's that old SF-trope that the cause of many of humanity's biggest problems is humans.

You could say the same about Windows though
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