Modern action films fetishize the body even as they desexualize it • Hacker News Board

Re: Modern action films fetishize the body even as they desexualize it

#231

Post by nradov » Mon, Mar 08, 2021, 4:59 AM UTC

gibbonsrcool wrote: post #64

Animats wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find the War on Terror explanation a little far fetched. Yes, that was a bit much. The Cold War produced a much more serious fitness boom, especially during the Kennedy Administration.[1] It also produced an education boom. Today, 71% of young Americans are ineligible to serve in the military.[2] Too fat, too dumb, too criminal, or too drugged. There seems to be little concern about this at political levels. [1] ht…

I wonder if the lack of concern is because of the future of autonomous warfare. There's drones of course, but also tech that enables things like aircraft carriers to run with much fewer crew. I'm betting that national healthcare will cause a fitness boom. We'll start seeing each other's poor health as tax money, and there will be more stigma for being overweight.

Running ships with much fewer crew is fine until something breaks and needs to be repaired. The Navy tried that for a while with the LCS and it didn't work.

Re: Modern action films fetishize the body even as they desexualize it

#232

Post by rayiner » Mon, Mar 08, 2021, 5:01 AM UTC

Considering how often actresses complain about how sex scenes are unpleasant, and the whole Harvey Weinstein thing, I’d say this is a positive development.

Re: Modern action films fetishize the body even as they desexualize it

#233

Post by tayo42 » Mon, Mar 08, 2021, 5:01 AM UTC

rayiner wrote: post #122

tayo42 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did boomers use more drugs? Since the boomer generation we had a crack epidemic, 2 heroine, 1 of those mixed with prescription opiates, and a non stop meth problem. Marijuana is legal in a bunch of states now. Psychedelics are having a revival. Mdma didn't even exist until recently and there have been two waves of rave culture

See: https://mobile.twitter.com/adam_tooze/status/121316563032673... > At their peak in 1980 illegal drugs accounted for 5 % of total personal consumption expenditure in US. An astonishing figure corroborated by contemporary estimates that cocaine sales peaked at $35bn in 1980. Rachel Soloveichik @BEA_News

Those comments in the thread have interesting points. 350/g in 1980 compared to what it costs now. (I used to pay 60/g around 2010)

https://www.businessinsider.com/us-cocaine-prices-change-201...

Thinking about it more, I guess you need to clarify if a boomers today use more drugs or was drug use higher in the 60s,70s,80s then in 00s and 10s. Other stuff I searched suggested boomers in the 10s are hit hard by opioids

Re: Modern action films fetishize the body even as they desexualize it

#234

Post by heterodoxxed » Mon, Mar 08, 2021, 5:02 AM UTC

hirundo wrote: post #35

Is this a side effect of normalizing porn, that sexuality is more effectively partitioned? I once had a debate in an online forum about legalizing prostitution, and most participants were supportive of it. Then I asked the same group, what about legalizing partial prostitution, like a receptionist that also has sex with the boss as part of the job description. The participants all immediately switched to revulsion at…

Sex work and pugilism I think can be strongly equated. Both involve using ones body and adult consent. One for sex, the other for violence.

We don't outlaw boxing or MMA. But we put regulations on it. We shut down illegal basement fights. And we hope people going into it aren't coerced and have recourse if something goes wrong. We accept that if an adult wants to get punched in the face for money that's something society can accommodate with reasonable expectations.

But there's no world where we would see a boss getting in the ring with his employees to fight for money as something acceptable.

Re: Modern action films fetishize the body even as they desexualize it

#235

Post by viraptor » Mon, Mar 08, 2021, 5:03 AM UTC

miserablegit wrote: post #61

brushfoot wrote: post #16

There are interesting ideas here. Personally, I find the War on Terror explanation a little far fetched. I think a more likely possibility is that movies started specializing. In the decades before the Internet, cinema was one place where the average person who didn't buy dirty magazines could glimpse more skin than in everyday life. Then the Internet came along. Suddenly pornography was in everyone's home. Soon it w…

> The public had infinite access to the sexual equivalent of gourmet food If you think porn is "gourmet", you've not watched enough of it. Porn is the McDonalds of sex: repetitive, predictable, largely "safe" (with minimal care, you won't see what you don't want to see), and purposedly all-encompassing but still largely detached from the real thing. I'm an unabashed porn consumer and I have to tell you, I yearn for a…

Have a look at Cindy Gallop's Make Love Not Porn https://makelovenotporn.tv/ - it's been going for a few years now.

It's kind of what you describe. It's like pornhub's "home" videos idea but a 1000 times better - actually curated, personal and real. Haven't followed them recently but at the beginning they actually organised camera setups for people who wanted to be featured.

Re: Modern action films fetishize the body even as they desexualize it

#236

Post by aksss » Mon, Mar 08, 2021, 5:03 AM UTC

joe_the_user wrote: post #79

hirundo wrote: post #35

Is this a side effect of normalizing porn, that sexuality is more effectively partitioned? I once had a debate in an online forum about legalizing prostitution, and most participants were supportive of it. Then I asked the same group, what about legalizing partial prostitution, like a receptionist that also has sex with the boss as part of the job description. The participants all immediately switched to revulsion at…

So why is 100% sex work less exploitative than 50% sex work? Gotta say that often questions like this are often as just taken as ways to win rhetorical points and not thought about seriously by those who ask them. But there's actually a good answer. Yes, sex work is extremely exploitative in the sense that you selling a "big piece" of yourself. Which doesn't mean it should be illegal but it should segregated. Why? Ot…

Honestly those examples you provided take a lot more skill and effort than most people put into exploitive sex. The consequences of doing those examples “wrong” are far higher, too, e.g. loss of life or limb.

I think a better retort would be that people want professional jobs where their contribution is based on seemingly objective merit. If 50% of your performance is judged by one person in an entirely subjective way, i.e. their satisfaction with sex, it’s not a very well protected job for one thing. Further, the benefit of exploitive sex industries is not having to commit - to be able to switch it up. Tightly coupling your exploitive sex with job positions whose value increases directly with the amount of institutional knowledge retained would not be wise - your turnover or dissatisfaction would be too high. Finally, despite all the efforts of exploitive industries, sex is still a biological function and very personal to many (most?). There are subtle relationships involved in such intimacy despite efforts to avoid it. From a management perspective, there’s a risk to being “friends” with people that work for you, much less having sex with them. I think it would introduce too many opportunities for personal feelings interrupting optimal productivity. Put directly, the integrity of your decision-making ability on behalf of the company would likely be compromised.

Re: Modern action films fetishize the body even as they desexualize it

#237

Post by pretendscholar » Mon, Mar 08, 2021, 5:03 AM UTC

astrange wrote: post #229

pretendscholar wrote: post #187

No discussion of endocrine disruption? Endrocrine distruption could explain a loss in libido. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2021/02/27/falling-sperm...

So give people zinc and maca supplements. Isn't it a lot more likely to be increased access to birth control? Which people take for very good reasons, but it disrupts your hormones a lot more than plastic does. That's the point of taking it.

Which would only explain women right? Male sperm counts are down dramatically over the last 20 years.

Re: Modern action films fetishize the body even as they desexualize it

#238

Post by throwaway198919 » Mon, Mar 08, 2021, 5:04 AM UTC

throway98752343 wrote: post #96

throwaway77767 wrote: post #11

> This cinematic trend reflects the culture around it. Even before the pandemic hit, Millennials and Zoomers were less sexually active than the generation before them. Maybe we’re too anxious about the Apocalypse; maybe we’re too broke to go out; maybe having to live with roommates or our parents makes it a little awkward to bring a partner home; maybe there are chemicals in the environment screwing up our hormones;…

The youngest millennials are around 25 years old. Changing your "not sexually active" situation will take putting yourself out there a lot, lowering your standards (you can raise them later), being open to meeting all sorts and getting rejected a lot. You'll certainly gain entertaining stories, and you'll probably meet some new friends, possibly one or more lovers and one of them may become a romantic partner if that…

I'm not OP but I'm not sexually active either and share the same worries and am probably a few years older than him.

Thanks for sharing those videos, even though I was able to make that physique/style/life control transformation several times (get fit -> fall into a hole -> get fit again, rinse and repeat) during my 20s, this pandemic made me fall into a rut and I'm heavily struggling to stay on the right track that makes me climb up again. These videos are were another spark of motivation to try again.

As for the "not sexually active" situation, I've noticed the feeling of frustration has become more intense and had made me more sad about it lately. As an introvert, the co-workers social circle is usually one of the main ones, but unfortunately I'm working alone because it has many more pros (own schedule -> go to gym when it's deserted, beat traffic, do errands at times where there are less waiting times, etc). Old college friends are starting to get married and be more busy, so I've been seeing them less, so less opportunity to be introduced to new people. I've tried salsa classes before the pandemic but didn't workout for that matter (couples that are very private, people that leave once the class ends, tight groups of friends). I've also tried the Tinder way, and the closest I've ended with a woman from it, she ended up losing interest when the pandemic started. Now I'm seeing someone from Tinder, and even though it will probably stay at friendship I'm taking it.

I've been seeing a therapist since a couple years ago after I had my first panic attack, since then I've been using therapy for all my issues. However, even though I've been open about my sexual frustrations, I feel like my therapist ignores it and simply tries to work on my social aspect in general. My therapist is female and I wonder if having a male therapist it would be different, I've been wanting to try but I already invested many sessions with my current therapist.

Re: Modern action films fetishize the body even as they desexualize it

#239

Post by rayiner » Mon, Mar 08, 2021, 5:05 AM UTC

wj wrote: post #54

EdwardDiego wrote: post #14

I think this is why British crime dramas / police procedurals seem to feel more real (to me, raised in a post-colonial country) - very few people look like temporarily financially embarrassed models slumming it as detectives.

Agreed. British shows have characters that look like what people outside of LA look like.

In fact those people are smoking by British standards.

Re: Modern action films fetishize the body even as they desexualize it

#240

Post by dopidop » Mon, Mar 08, 2021, 5:05 AM UTC

spc476 wrote: post #102

milchek wrote: post #27

This was a fun read, especially as someone who grew up with those 80s and 90s movies. That said, and as the author touches on, the action/super hero of today is a PG-13 one. Studios need to reach the widest audience possible to make the most money, so it's a safer bet. Sure, back in the day studios had the same imperative, but the licensed toy game was still young, so they didn't realise that maybe if they made Die H…

Having an R-rating didn't mean a lack of toys. "Alien" came out in 1979 to an R-rating. Yet a friend at the time (we were both 10) received a 12" (30cm) xenomorph action figure for Christmas.

Correct. But a movie about incest, rape or pedophilia would probably not quality.

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