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Californians aren’t leaving the state en masse but are leaving San Francisco

latimes.com

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Re: Californians aren’t leaving the state en masse but are leaving San Francisco

#291

Post by [deleted] »

rayiner wrote: post #252
judge2020 wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So your solution is not to kick the wealthy out of the union, but to kick California out of the union, simply because it has a large population of wealthy people?

The problem isn’t the wealthy people per se. The problem is industries like tech that generate highly paid upper middle class jobs that most people aren’t qualified for (and realistically will never be qualified for), as opposed to a larger number of middle class jobs that most people can be qualified for. There is a reason people pine for coal and oil jobs. Head out to east or west Texas sometime. Lots of prosperity…

[deleted]

Re: Californians aren’t leaving the state en masse but are leaving San Francisco

#292

Post by NotChina »

sampo wrote: post #130
birken wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SF is over 5x denser than Dallas, which is the densest major city in Texas. The problem with homelessness is people can't afford to live in homes. It is a lot easier to avoid homelessness when you have essentially endless space to build housing.

> SF is over 5x denser than Dallas San Francisco is also 3x less dense than Paris (Paris, France). SF could add homes for 1.5 million people and still be as livable as Paris, if it wanted to.

Paris is not on a fault line either. Or built on large portions of land that suffer from liquid faction.

Re: Californians aren’t leaving the state en masse but are leaving San Francisco

#293

Post by bootlooped »

rayiner wrote: post #252
judge2020 wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So your solution is not to kick the wealthy out of the union, but to kick California out of the union, simply because it has a large population of wealthy people?

The problem isn’t the wealthy people per se. The problem is industries like tech that generate highly paid upper middle class jobs that most people aren’t qualified for (and realistically will never be qualified for), as opposed to a larger number of middle class jobs that most people can be qualified for. There is a reason people pine for coal and oil jobs. Head out to east or west Texas sometime. Lots of prosperity…

The financial sector is probably a larger driver of income inequality than tech. Do you kick out NYC too?

Re: Californians aren’t leaving the state en masse but are leaving San Francisco

#294

Post by ralusek »

birken wrote: post #54
czbond wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'Allow' and 'not enforce for motivated individuals' are very close together.

The laws are enforced. I haven't seen any conclusive evidence that shows Prop 47 has led to higher crime rates. In fact there are many studies which show there isn't any, while at the same time the state is saving tons of money not incarcerating non-violent offenders. I haven't seen any conclusive evidence that Chesa Boudin has led to higher crime rates, though I'm not sure how controlled the comparison is of pandemi…

The consensus on there not being an increase in the crime rate is that police are no longer responding to crimes...so there is no increase in the statistics of criminality...

Re: Californians aren’t leaving the state en masse but are leaving San Francisco

#295

Post by NotChina »

mdgrech23 wrote: post #140
hindsightbias wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SF trolled tech and let them have the Tenderloin. It took all those bright folks a decade to figure it out.

Don't understand this comment? Did SF encourage tech companies to locate in the Tenderloin?

Yes. It did. The mayor was in our office to celebrate the tax incentives of companies to relocate there. Then Twitter followed.

Re: Californians aren’t leaving the state en masse but are leaving San Francisco

#296

Post by dcolkitt »

Moodles wrote: post #17
systemvoltage wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People of San Francisco passed a law t̶o̶ ̶a̶l̶l̶o̶w̶ ̶a̶n̶y̶ ̶r̶o̶b̶b̶e̶r̶y̶ ̶u̶n̶d̶e̶r̶ ̶$̶1̶0̶0̶0̶ ̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶y̶o̶u̶ ̶c̶a̶n̶'̶t̶ ̶f̶i̶l̶e̶ ̶a̶ ̶c̶a̶s̶e̶ ̶o̶r̶ ̶c̶a̶l̶l̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶c̶o̶p̶s̶.̶ They also expect safe neighborhoods. You can't have both. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26040812 Liberal policies such as this does not solve the actual problem. Instead of providing food and shelter to the poor, perhaps st…

Yeah, but we throw a really nice gay pride parade to show we're good people. Loads of BLM support on walls. Many of my colleagues updated their instagram filters.

The thing is, as San Franciscans, we really support all the oppressed transgender teenagers in Mississippi. What's that? Build more housing, so they can actually afford to move here and escape the oppression they face in Mississippi? Uh, no, you see, we support them to the extent that it doesn't affect our property values...

Re: Californians aren’t leaving the state en masse but are leaving San Francisco

#297

Post by NotChina »

jeffbee wrote: post #172
coryrc wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more sarcasm than not. He's saying it was never a desirable area but tech companies moved there anyway despite theoretically having the money to be nicer places.

Name a tech company with an office in the Tenderloin.

Zendesk, twitter, and dozens more.

Re: Californians aren’t leaving the state en masse but are leaving San Francisco

#298

Post by Lammy »

api wrote: post #92
Lammy wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way San Francisco is managed finally made sense to me (in a bad way) once I learned about the Second Great Migration and the fact that there was basically no black population here until World War 2. Making the cost of living as expensive as possible is a wonderfully deniable way to drive out people who have been repeatedly denied the ability to build generational wealth: https://www.forbes.com/sites/priceonomics/…

I've thought this for a while: NIMBYism and other anti-development policies is how liberals implement "red lining" with plausible deniability... even to themselves. They're not trying to exclude the poor and minorities. They're trying to protect the environment! Never mind that these policies encourage sprawl and waste.

Let’s not make this a partisan thing please. Remember the EPA is from the Nixon administration, for example :)

Re: Californians aren’t leaving the state en masse but are leaving San Francisco

#299

Post by ralusek »

maybelsyrup wrote: post #173
ajmurmann wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's puzzling to me that NIMBYism seems so common among people who identify as liberal. It's clearly just another way of kicking away the ladder and is inherently with the stated goals of liberalism. At least neo-liberals seems to have gotten this one 100% correct.

I'm wondering what you think of the idea that the people we call "liberal" in this country aren't really all that "leftist" - they're just more left than our "conservatives". This is especially true for economic beliefs, I find. Like, ask an Italian communist (they still exist!) whether Joe Biden is a leftist and he'll choke from laughter on his ravioli. And after all, Barack Obama's world leader bff wasn't some Gree…

Liberalism isn't a leftist ideology, why on earth would you expect a liberal to be a leftist?

Re: Californians aren’t leaving the state en masse but are leaving San Francisco

#300

Post by _-david-_ »

mbgerring wrote: post #147

I’ve lived in San Francisco for about ten years and I’ve never been more excited about the future of this city. We have an incredible opportunity to build a city that works for everyone and not just a glorified dorm room complex for young tech workers. The next few years are looking very good!

What makes you think that things are going to change? I don't live in SF, but things look like they are getting worse.
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