Ask HN: Is abuse from supervisors as common in industry as in academia?

Maths. Yeah it's a while but I was having fun; at the end of each 2-3 year contract someone would say "would you be interested ..." and I'd take it up. While my work was pretty solid, it wasn't stellar and I didn't really publish enough to warrant a lecturer post, I realised that early on. I once met a woman who'd been doing non-standard analysis (which is both left-field and old-school) as a postdoc for years and I asked her if she saw a future in it, "not really, but while the music plays, I will dance".

So... former tenured professor here. I've seen both sides of the coin. I've had grad students who I felt like pulling my hair out about because they expected you to guide them through every single little thing. They were very good at following instructions to a T, but they had to have every single instruction, and if you didn't provide it, they blamed you for not providing enough guidance.

On the other side of things, I've seen extremely abusive colleagues, with recurring problems with grad students (and faculty). All sorts of abuse, from just outright aggression, including physical aggression, to coercion into academic fraud, you name it. In a couple of cases things have gotten attention but most of the time nothing happens, or the student just eventually exits the program without a degree because they've had enough.

I agree with others that the primary difference is that it seems like in the nonacademic world people have more flexibility to move elsewhere. There's a lot of fuzzy overlap between the academic and nonacademic world, but at the moment even in the best circumstances academics is rife with corruption and problems, depending on what field you're in. When you erect a pyramid scheme and come to institutionally depend on it, you're bound to run into problems.

I think the big variable is how fast your organization is growing, and not so much the "kind" of organization.

If you are in a place where everything's growing (more funding, more revenue), all your peers will get promoted with you, and you won't have to compete (or behave in a zero-sum way) to do it. Cultures develop "politics" in different ways, but I think the unifying theme is zero-sum behavior.

The average age of tenure has gone up over the last 30 years, which suggests fewer early-career opportunities and more competition. But there are tech companies that double their employee count every year, which has a very different feel.

I think the reason academia can be a famously toxic place to work is tenure.

When people are unfireable and can't change jobs, people who hate each other are forced to work together for decades.

Not entirely different from marriages when divorce is illegal/unthinkable.

Which is one reason I think "employment at will" is a very important concept.

Yep. It happens.

Unfortunately not everyone is as lucky to be able to up and quit when these things happen.

* Visa holders are often susceptible to this kind of abuse. Low wages, can't job hop, etc.

* Those who are bound by health care. Being healthy isn't a privilege everyone enjoys.

* Those without safety nets. Not just people who grew up poor that have no place to turn if things get bad. This could be you if you live paycheck to paycheck. If you have to choose between being homeless and an abusive work place, most are going to take the abuse.

For every person that you hear mention that their workplace is great and wonderful, there is somebody else in the workforce who is suffering.