An example of Sayre's Law: "Academic politics are so vicious precisely because the stakes are so small."
Ask HN: Is abuse from supervisors as common in industry as in academia?
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Re: Ask HN: Is abuse from supervisors as common in industry as in academia?
#12I walked away from academia early on and went into working in IT because I felt (after a couple years) the earlier coursework didn't benefit me and wouldn't for some time.
I wonder if part of this process forces out anyone not willing to put up with the environment earlier on. At least in a program where this is the eventual circumstance?
In business it'd largely depend on the environment fostered at the outfit. But if you're allergic to that kind of behaviour you'll have a much easier time (as you assume) seeking different employ. As long as you do something multiple companies will employ you for.
Re: Ask HN: Is abuse from supervisors as common in industry as in academia?
#13I'd say that the issues in your first paragraph also occur in industry, albeit with plausible deniability and not directly.
Further annoyances in industry:
- Teams can suck you dry, you begin to lose your identity and get mediocre (since that is the safest and most valued option).
- Managers take the credit for your work.
- Managers can be entirely unrealistic, often demanding things that are not possible from a CS point of view.
- Too many meetings and "communication" to serve those who thrive on that sort of thing (i.e. the talkers).
As others said, in this job market you can move to another company without issues, which is the greatest advantage.
Re: Ask HN: Is abuse from supervisors as common in industry as in academia?
#14I would say it depends on the industry. In software engineering, in general, companies take extremely good care of their workforce because labor is very scarce and expensive. My other life experience is in architecture, and people are not treated nearly as well there, mainly because there’s a lot less scarcity of labor.
I don’t really know the dynamics of academia, but my impression is that there are a lot more people who want PhD’s and tenured professorships than there are openings for those roles, so knowing nothing else I would expect the work environment to be worse compared to software engineering.
Re: Ask HN: Is abuse from supervisors as common in industry as in academia?
#15That's the type of discussion/drama that I expect to see in Reddit, not in HN.
Re: Ask HN: Is abuse from supervisors as common in industry as in academia?
#16I have never been that deep into academia and I work at a non-tech Fortune 500 company. I would say that the abuses are somewhat more limited on an individual basis and it’s more of a collective effort of management to abuse their power. Not sure if that’s better or worse. There is no room for different ideas, it’s all kissing the butt of incompetents who are willing to play the game in order to get ahead.
Re: Ask HN: Is abuse from supervisors as common in industry as in academia?
#17I had a CS prof that boasted of only giving two As his entire career. And would structure tests so that wrong answers would be subtracted from right answers. He also did the blackboard thing where you needed to go up to the blackboard show that you understood some confusing algo paper he assigned, with him asking you questions to throw you off.
Guy was pretty hated by students. Someone tried breaking into his office one year. Part of me respects that he was trying to keep standards high, when there are so many bleeding hearts now. Still think it was a power trip.
Re: Ask HN: Is abuse from supervisors as common in industry as in academia?
#18I would say it depends on the industry. In software engineering, in general, companies take extremely good care of their workforce because labor is very scarce and expensive. My other life experience is in architecture, and people are not treated nearly as well there, mainly because there’s a lot less scarcity of labor. I don’t really know the dynamics of academia, but my impression is that there are a lot more peopl…
> In software engineering, in general, companies take extremely good care of their workforce because labor is very scarce and expensive.
Not that I've seen. I experienced a lot of "abuse" like OP mentioned in the last few years at my last job, and it was a common complaint from my peers at other companies around the country. It sounds to me like you're really lucky.
Re: Ask HN: Is abuse from supervisors as common in industry as in academia?
#19It’s a diffetent kind of abuse. The concept of climbing the corporate ladder only really exists for executives, not for corporate wage slaves.
As an academic your best career choice is to work your way up in one organization. As an engineer the expected strategy is to hop jobs every 2-4 years.
In (American) business, barring some unions, there is no concept of tenure and it is understood you will be fired the moment you screw up or you will quit once the abuse surpasses your level of tolerance.
Either way, as a worker, expect to be abused by management and peers. As an entrepreneur expect to be abused by creditors, vendors and investors.
The only way to avoid the abuse is to be born wealthy and not work.
Re: Ask HN: Is abuse from supervisors as common in industry as in academia?
#20They own you. Don't like it? Start your own company.