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Valve's Proton Has Enabled 7000 Windows Games on Linux

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Re: Valve's Proton Has Enabled 7000 Windows Games on Linux

#51

Post by gostsamo »

neogodless wrote: post #18
ThaDood wrote: post #4

Proton is the reason I moved from a Windows + MacOS machine to GNU/Linux full time. I understand the concern that some hardcore enthusiasts might have about it making devs lazy when it comes to developing native ports but to be honest I don't care. I am just glad to have a simple method of gaming on GNU/Linux. Proton plus Lutris and the slew other tools that have come out in recent years has made the transition to GN…

> making devs lazy when it comes to developing native ports Is this first order thinking? Whereas second order thinking might be "with Proton enabling an order of magnitude more users that enjoy PC gaming to move to Linux, studios might consider improving the PC gaming experience further with more native ports/testing directly on Linux?" I don't know if that's how things could play out, but it seems logical to me.

Proton will not make devs create Linux ports, but it will increase the user base and other devs might consider creating Linux ports for their non-game products.

Re: Valve's Proton Has Enabled 7000 Windows Games on Linux

#54

Post by jcelerier »

neogodless wrote: post #18
ThaDood wrote: post #4

Proton is the reason I moved from a Windows + MacOS machine to GNU/Linux full time. I understand the concern that some hardcore enthusiasts might have about it making devs lazy when it comes to developing native ports but to be honest I don't care. I am just glad to have a simple method of gaming on GNU/Linux. Proton plus Lutris and the slew other tools that have come out in recent years has made the transition to GN…

> making devs lazy when it comes to developing native ports Is this first order thinking? Whereas second order thinking might be "with Proton enabling an order of magnitude more users that enjoy PC gaming to move to Linux, studios might consider improving the PC gaming experience further with more native ports/testing directly on Linux?" I don't know if that's how things could play out, but it seems logical to me.

> studios might consider improving the PC gaming experience further with more native ports/testing directly on Linux?"

that does not match the historical experience of studios doing absolutely terrible ports of console exclusives to MS Windows, stuff like games where you can't rebind your keys and a qwerty layout is assumed, FPS is fixed at 30, etc etc

Re: Valve's Proton Has Enabled 7000 Windows Games on Linux

#55

Post by explodingcamera »

While it is definitely not streamlined and very expensive, I've had a wonderful experience running a Windows VM and passing one of my GPUs through to it. Even VR works flawlessly, which is otherwise unusable on a linux desktop. Proton definitely still has major issues. A lot of the well-rated games on protondb are barely playable. Still, I've played a lot of games using it I otherwise wouldn't be able to experience.

Re: Valve's Proton Has Enabled 7000 Windows Games on Linux

#56

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet »

tempest_ wrote: post #42
SteveNuts wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think SteamOS was mostly a political play, at the time microsoft looked like it was turning windows into a walled garden platform.

I think that was a large reason. Additionally the OUYA had some mind share and Valve was pushing Steam Machines and their Steam link so a non windows OS to run on them made sense. On reflection perhaps the Steam Machines and link were a response to the Windows Store as well but I cant remember the timelines that well.

SteamOS, Steam Machines, and Steam Link all occurred at about the same time and they were definitely a response to the perceived threat of Microsoft locking Windows down to only Windows Store applications.

Good news is that didn't happen and Valve continued to improve gaming on Linux for everyone for free anyways.

Re: Valve's Proton Has Enabled 7000 Windows Games on Linux

#57

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet »

ebegnwgnen wrote: post #50
Kees_Veel wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The games I mean. I guess I'm in the wrong topic here, but if you play those games, you implicitly have to trust their secret code on your network. User account and all. Obviously most here have done that a long time ago and don't even give it a second thought. This is normal in these times of Windows and Facebooks, but I still care.

I believe Valve is working on Flatpak sandboxing for games. If this happen that would be one more reason to game on Linux instead of Windows. It's not as good as open source but let's be real, you'll never get AAA open source games. Games don't need to access personal data (such as contact, phone number, photos, files, private messages, etc.) so with strong sandboxing I guess it could be a okay solution privacy-wise

To the best of my knowledge Valve's container system has no relation to Flatpak.

Re: Valve's Proton Has Enabled 7000 Windows Games on Linux

#58

Post by cf »

The problem with Proton is it is leading many game developers to actually drop Linux support. They basically say players seem to be able to get the game to work on Proton and that's that.

But with no official support there is no guarantee it will continue to work with updates. There is no promise to even try to make it work if it breaks. And that's the major stuff. Imagine spending 20, 30, or 60 dollars on a game that can break at any moment and know there will be zero support waiting for you. And that's hard breaks. Performance hiccups will be given zero attention by the developers.

There is all this talk that Proton will make people want to develop native Linux ports but I don't see any data or logic to back that up.

Re: Valve's Proton Has Enabled 7000 Windows Games on Linux

#59

Post by sandworm101 »

neogodless wrote: post #18
ThaDood wrote: post #4

Proton is the reason I moved from a Windows + MacOS machine to GNU/Linux full time. I understand the concern that some hardcore enthusiasts might have about it making devs lazy when it comes to developing native ports but to be honest I don't care. I am just glad to have a simple method of gaming on GNU/Linux. Proton plus Lutris and the slew other tools that have come out in recent years has made the transition to GN…

> making devs lazy when it comes to developing native ports Is this first order thinking? Whereas second order thinking might be "with Proton enabling an order of magnitude more users that enjoy PC gaming to move to Linux, studios might consider improving the PC gaming experience further with more native ports/testing directly on Linux?" I don't know if that's how things could play out, but it seems logical to me.

Because Proton creates a dangerous market pressure. The linux+proton user is the ideal customer for a game developer: someone paying full price but to whom you owe absolutely no obligations. Bug reports from Proton users can be safely ignored. They should feel lucky if the game even started under their not-supported hack of an operating system. But those who purchase a native linux client (KSP, Factorio, Prison Architect etc) have to be offered at least a modicum of support.

I like proton. I really like being able to play subnautica. But every time a game updates I cringe a little because I know any new linux-related bugs are more my problem than theirs. I would much rather have game developers treat linux users as full customers.

Re: Valve's Proton Has Enabled 7000 Windows Games on Linux

#60

Post by renonce »

neogodless wrote: post #18
ThaDood wrote: post #4

Proton is the reason I moved from a Windows + MacOS machine to GNU/Linux full time. I understand the concern that some hardcore enthusiasts might have about it making devs lazy when it comes to developing native ports but to be honest I don't care. I am just glad to have a simple method of gaming on GNU/Linux. Proton plus Lutris and the slew other tools that have come out in recent years has made the transition to GN…

> making devs lazy when it comes to developing native ports Is this first order thinking? Whereas second order thinking might be "with Proton enabling an order of magnitude more users that enjoy PC gaming to move to Linux, studios might consider improving the PC gaming experience further with more native ports/testing directly on Linux?" I don't know if that's how things could play out, but it seems logical to me.

Even if devs don't make native ports they would still work on improving compatibility with Proton as long as there are fresh Linux players
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