Just wanted to say that the books were not banned; Dr Seuss’ family decided to pull the books because yeah, the dude made some racist books. “Canceling” him would mean banning his entire catalog, which I haven’t heard anyone suggest. But this wasn’t the publisher; this was the copyright holder deciding they no longer wanted this speech in the world.
Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay
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Re: Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay
#882Earlier quoted context omitted.
There's two kinds of freedom: freedom from and freedom to. These are some children's books that contain illustrations that some people find offensive and the publisher (and sellers) are deciding they no longer want to be associated with and sell to children. There are internet forums where the images are available and people can view them without the police knocking your door down, and I'm sure these are available in…
To be clear the "freedom from" I'm referring to here is the freedom for innocent bystanders - children in this case - not to see lazy racial stereotypes surreptitiously in what should be a funny book that either offends them or gives them a false/bad impression of those races. Throughout history society has decided what (legal) things are acceptable in public - public executions, graphic sexuality, violence. Today, (…
Every time I see people espouse "freedom from", I have to point out you're making a claim on everyone else to keep you safe from something you don't like.
You don't have that right. The world is not safe. Nowhere are you guaranteed happiness, or refuge from upsetting ideas. You are guaranteed the right to pursue happiness. The outcome is a function of how fast your legs are.
In a nation that sincerely values the concept of Liberty, the Public Safety (a subset of which is your presumed "freedom from") always takes a second seat. To have it any other way is to put an end to the very ideal at the center of the United States. Liberty is scary. Freedom makes no guarantees. Non-hackers can feel free to not consume in their own spaces, but don't start trying to dictate what others should or should not have access to.
Re: Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay
#883I remember being in school decades ago and our very left-wing English teacher telling us about the Catholic Church's index of banned books, which included things like Henry Miller's Tropic of Cancer. At the same time, you also had a big push by Evangelical groups in the U.S. to ban books like Deliverance from school due to their graphic sexual content.
If you had told me then that in 2021, it would be secular liberal democrats pushing to ban books, I would have laughed in your face, but here we are, and I'm not laughing.
Re: Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay
#884Earlier quoted context omitted.
Germany here, we banned Mein Kampf from being sold (used copyright law to do that). I once stood in a book shop (teenager, time to look at books but not enough money to buy them) and some skindheads wanted to buy it, it wasn't available. They went away. Providing context is good, but frankly also really difficult and why not just provide newer childrens books that are more inclusive.
I read Mein Kamp when I was younger (in Australia) out of sheer curiosity, and found it to be rambling, poorly written junk, bordering on incoherent. If you came away enlightened, you probably already held very strong Nazi tendencies before you even opened the book.
Nazi and hardcore communist propaganda have appeal to lost people, who have no place in the world, and usually are surrounded by other sources of bad influence. Is the same with people who are attracted to be part of street gangs, and other stuff like that. They are already part of a broken family, and community to end up with this kind of behaviour.
Re: Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay
#885Earlier quoted context omitted.
There's two kinds of freedom: freedom from and freedom to. These are some children's books that contain illustrations that some people find offensive and the publisher (and sellers) are deciding they no longer want to be associated with and sell to children. There are internet forums where the images are available and people can view them without the police knocking your door down, and I'm sure these are available in…
These are market-dominating book distributors like Amazon and eBay effectively deciding what people can and cannot read. The fact that a few people might still be able to view images of these books (illegally, as they are copyrighted) on some tiny closed forum on the internet isn't a real comfort. In the Soviet Union, there were also tiny isolated pockets where "forbidden books" were surreptitiously copied and read.…
This is not banning a book. This is the rights holder (a sizeable corporation) making a business decision to stop publishing a book.
Re: Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay
#886I am not sure this is about free speech even though it looks like it on the surface.
I personally think its a replacement of classic american culture with which most of new population ( immigrants, minorities ect) cannot identify with, something that "others" them. I talked to my extended circle of 'new comers' and no one cares about Dr. Suess and would prefer for it to be gone, so we don't have to be outsiders.
I think this is just the start. Classic americanism would be relegated to museums in next 20 yrs.
I remember only 10-20 yrs ago 'assimilation' was thing for immigrants. Assimilation meant learning about things like Dr. Suess. Now assimilation is not a thing anymore, might actually be considered offensive.
Re: Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay
#887Earlier quoted context omitted.
These are market-dominating book distributors like Amazon and eBay effectively deciding what people can and cannot read. The fact that a few people might still be able to view images of these books (illegally, as they are copyrighted) on some tiny closed forum on the internet isn't a real comfort. In the Soviet Union, there were also tiny isolated pockets where "forbidden books" were surreptitiously copied and read.…
This is not banning a book. This is the rights holder (a sizeable corporation) making a business decision to stop publishing a book.
No, this is a company preventing people from selling a previously published (and purchased) copy of a book. This is book banning.
Re: Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay
#888It's time for secession. Rational, un-woke areas of countries need to declare independence from their failing woke governments. If you want to live in woke hell, choose a woke country. Rational people can live in rational countries. Talk of melting pots is quaint, and unworkable.
Re: Dr. Seuss books deemed offensive will be delisted from eBay
#889Earlier quoted context omitted.
Freedom of speech is the most essential negative freedom (freedom from), it means you are not bound and limited by something external, while positive freedom is a right to something, like education or similar institutions. The freedom of a publisher to control what happens to sold books isn't at all part of negative freedom (freedom from). I'm basing my understanding on the Two Concepts of Liberty by Isaiah Berlin.
Why is this being downvoted? It's providing necessary clarification of a concept that was being misused in the parent.
See if you can find something intrinsically flawed with this (simplified) belief:
> Freedom of speech ... means you are not bound and limited by something external
https://www.uscourts.gov/about-federal-courts/educational-re...