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Killing TurboTax

kunle.app

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Re: Killing TurboTax

#311

Post by ska »

ed25519FUUU wrote: post #253
edoceo wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Generally no. Data you get from FOIA requests is generally limited with what you can do with it. State specific laws, your use-case not withstanding

FOIA results can definitely go into public domain. That's sort of the point.

> That's sort of the point.

It really isn't - the point is freedom access, not free use. Information acquired this way doesn't magically become public domain, it may (or may not) have other constraints on it.

See e.g. https://www.justice.gov/oip/blog/foia-update-oip-guidance-co...

Re: Killing TurboTax

#312

Post by bob1029 »

astura wrote: post #309
bob1029 wrote: post #298

"Killing TurboTax" is essentially a meme until we meaningfully simplify the tax code. There is no software development team on earth who could catch up with the full capabilities of TurboTax without some sort of fundamental shift in the business. I really hate to say this as someone who makes a living out of it, but dealing with the current amount of complexity in the tax code with a piece of software that a non-expe…

The IRS themselves need to provide this "auto tax" service.

As noted in other comments here, an "auto tax" service only really works on the happy path. There are parts of the tax code which are highly subjective in more complex situations and require explicit elections on part of the filing party. These elections can have consequences far beyond the immediate tax filing transaction.

Re: Killing TurboTax

#313

Post by namdnay »

Faaak wrote: post #84
ISL wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it possible to FOIA the IRS tax-computation code itself?

It'been done for french taxes (even though the online app is government made and free): https://github.com/etalab/taxe-fonciere , https://github.com/etalab/taxe-habitation , and more that I don't remember

It wasn’t FOIAd, etalab is a government department (they’ve done a few cool things, there’s also an interactive map of property transactions with surface and price

Re: Killing TurboTax

#314

Post by astura »

coldpie wrote: post #72
xrd wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> please don't use this software to file your taxes for the 2020 / 2021 tax season. I wonder if there is a PR that Intuit filed to add this to the readme. Seriously, I wonder how much money Intuit has spent to terrify people into using their software. Each year, I look around for alternatives so I can avoid giving them money, and each year I find some reason to grow fearful of an IRS audit and go with the company tha…

Unless you really screw up[1], or are intentionally trying to screw the IRS[2], you don't have to worry about an audit. The IRS's goal isn't to bring down their wrath upon you, their goal is to accurately collect the taxes they are due. If you pay too little, they'll ask you to pay the difference. If you pay too much, they'll refund it. Really: I once used the single-payer tax table instead of the filing-jointly tax…

Which begs the question if they essentially already know how much tax they think you should owe (for most people) why don't they present that number to get first and let you either agree or disagree?

Re: Killing TurboTax

#315

Post by matz1 »

lolsal wrote: post #304
trymas wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a racket. Government already knows how much you owe them. So how about US government, like most modern countries, send you a form which says: "we think you owe us xxx$ (because of this and that), if not - provide extra information"?

> It's a racket. Yea, possibly (I agree with you). It is as much a racket as lots of other things. Doesn't excuse it being a racket, but TurboTax is not an anomaly. > Government already knows how much you owe them. This is false. If you aren't taking advantage of deductions, sophisticated tax-deferred vehicles for retirement or tax-advantaged accounts for other investments, you're giving the IRS more than you have to…

Then how do IRS know that the duduction is correct?

Re: Killing TurboTax

#316

Post by azog_alone »

bob1029 wrote: post #298

"Killing TurboTax" is essentially a meme until we meaningfully simplify the tax code. There is no software development team on earth who could catch up with the full capabilities of TurboTax without some sort of fundamental shift in the business. I really hate to say this as someone who makes a living out of it, but dealing with the current amount of complexity in the tax code with a piece of software that a non-expe…

The reason the tax code is so complicated is BECAUSE OF TurboTax. They lobby heavily to keep things complex and have brought down potential competitors through legal means.

As such, "killing TurboTax" is the correct first step.

Re: Killing TurboTax

#317

Post by astura »

bob1029 wrote: post #312
astura wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The IRS themselves need to provide this "auto tax" service.

As noted in other comments here, an "auto tax" service only really works on the happy path. There are parts of the tax code which are highly subjective in more complex situations and require explicit elections on part of the filing party. These elections can have consequences far beyond the immediate tax filing transaction.

No, it can work with the complicated path too, they present you with what they already know about you and give you the opportunity to add more information that they don't yet know. They then calculate what you owe and tell you.

At some point they are going to calculate what you owe based on what you provide them and what is reported to them, no matter what.

Laws that authorize "auto tax" can also come with extra reporting requirements.

Re: Killing TurboTax

#318

Post by Finnucane »

nicoburns wrote: post #87
Finnucane wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Turbotax et al. lobby heavily to prevent this. Given that much of the relevant information--W2s, 1099s, etc., are already reported, you'd think that this would be easier for a very large percentage of taxpayers. But it would effectively kill TurboTax's business.

Couldn't the legislators just... not do what the lobbyists want? Are they really all that corrupt?

They can ignore the lobbyists, but they like the money, and they like not having to campaign against the lobbyist's marketing. Enough to make it difficult to pass reforms.

Re: Killing TurboTax

#319

Post by dave5104 »

astura wrote: post #317
bob1029 wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As noted in other comments here, an "auto tax" service only really works on the happy path. There are parts of the tax code which are highly subjective in more complex situations and require explicit elections on part of the filing party. These elections can have consequences far beyond the immediate tax filing transaction.

No, it can work with the complicated path too, they present you with what they already know about you and give you the opportunity to add more information that they don't yet know. They then calculate what you owe and tell you. At some point they are going to calculate what you owe based on what you provide them and what is reported to them, no matter what. Laws that authorize "auto tax" can also come with extra repo…

Not to mention, I'm sure the "happy path" will accommodate a significant number of tax payers.

Re: Killing TurboTax

#320

Post by colejohnson66 »

mumblemumble wrote: post #310
colejohnson66 wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Correct. Companies like Intuit lobby the government to keep complex tax codes so they can provide services that make it easy.

It's not quite that simple. There's a lot of popular political support for things that make a simpler tax season impossible, too. For example, the existence of tax-advantaged savings vehicles such as IRAs and HSAs mean that the taxable portion of your income isn't settled until the deadline for making contributions for that tax year. Which is April 15. But I imagine there would be a lot of popular political backlash…

Yes, but for things where all you have is a W-2, the IRS could easily do your taxes for you. They could send everyone a letter saying, “based on what we have, these are your numbers. If you want to change what we know, feel free to file yourself or with something like TurboTax.” Then you get the best of both worlds: people with simple taxes don’t have to deal with it, and people with complex situations can keep doing what they’re doing.

The (previous) existence of the 1040EZ showed that a lot of people have simple returns that the IRS could do for them.

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