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The Framework Laptop

frame.work

961–970 of 1001 posts

Re: The Framework Laptop

#961

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Show me a better multi-purpose input device that I can use to rotate objects on a screen. The obvious answer to the challenge is a touch screen .

I actually buy this conclusion for this use case, but in fairness the debate was "keyboard vs touchpad". So touchscreen > touchpad > keyboard for rotating objects. But for other things, having to reach up to the screen (e.g., scrolling), is worse than touchpad. With a trackpad, I only have to articulate my wrist while my arm remains resting on the surface; with a touch screen, I have to lift my whole arm and articula…

I'm not a touch screen fanatic but I think using your whole arm instead of just torquing your wrist all day is considered a feature?

Obviously it's not as great if the measure you're looking at is "how quickly can I go back to typing?".

Re: The Framework Laptop

#962

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Your point is only correct if you replace the word "most" with "my." The fact that trackpads are hugely popular indicates that your needs are not typical, and you should not impose your choices upon others with different needs. But Apple trackpads are not hugely popular, they have a fraction (~10%, likely less) of the global market. Does the fact that non-Apple computers are hugely popular indicate that the needs of…

> But Apple trackpads are not hugely popular, they have a fraction (~10%, likely less) of the global market. The person you're replying to said "trackpads are popular" with no mention of Apple. Your entire argument so far has been against trackpads in general. Why shift goalposts?

Is it even called a "trackpad" outside of Apple machines? I'm pretty sure they're called "touchpads" generally. So maybe "trackpad" is inherently referent to Apple.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#963

Reading down the proposed spec sheet, I'm starting to see how crappy the competition is! * Apple MacBook - Nothing configurable. Expensive and not build to be repaired. * Microsoft Surface - Much the same, but with Windows * Lenovo Thinkpad - A little more configurable than a MacBook, and much better value, but still difficult to repair. Missing premium features like an Aluminium case. * Dell XPS 13 - Much like the L…

Is the thinkpad better value than the MacBook?

The i7 16GB ram / 512GB ssd Thinkpad X1 Carbon is $1900 and you don't even get a nice display. The M1 16GB/512GB ssd Macbook Pro is only $1700 and you get a best-in-class display along with that.

The XPS 13 and Surface are similarly priced. Macbooks are very price competitive and have been for a long time.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#964

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But Apple trackpads are not hugely popular, they have a fraction (~10%, likely less) of the global market. The person you're replying to said "trackpads are popular" with no mention of Apple. Your entire argument so far has been against trackpads in general. Why shift goalposts?

Is it even called a "trackpad" outside of Apple machines? I'm pretty sure they're called "touchpads" generally. So maybe "trackpad" is inherently referent to Apple.

> Is it even called a "trackpad" outside of Apple machines?

Yes.

https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/faqs/laptop-faqs/what-is-a-trac...

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/surface-trackpad-settings/...

http://support.blackberry.com/kb/articleDetail?articleNumber...

https://edgeup.asus.com/2019/the-asus-screenpad-2-0-lets-the...

https://wikidiff.com/trackpad/touchpad

Trackpad and touchpad are generic synonyms according to every source I can find.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#965
post #685

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Having to press yet another additional modifier key destroys usability and muscle memory I'm far more comfortable moving my fingers and thumbs as little as possible rather than having to stretch far and wide for those extra function keys.

For me it’s the opposite: I get RSI from having to stretch my hands to press 2-3 modifiers simultaneously, whereas moving my hands a bit is no problem.

Right, which is why I wanted the non-stretching version. The modifiers are quite reachable with about 50-52 keys.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#966
post #360

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It wasn't that long ago when manufacturers like Dell and Lenovo had models where you could basically replace almost everything. I guess still models like the T14 allows you to replace RAM, SSD, Wi-Fi card, keyboard, touchpad and even the screen. For the older models, even screen replacements are quite common in the ThinkPad community... Good luck for this project though, we really need more companies like this!

On some older Thinkpads, even CPU replacement was on the menu.

I think the 2012 generation was the last one. T420 at least.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#967

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I think the SD card example encapsulates the issue perfectly It does. Micro-sd-card reader fits even in raspberryPi Zero ... Neglectable "space saving" advantage vs huge usability disadvantage. > The point of a laptop is to strike a balance between portability and usability. I think MacbookPro should be about philosophy of amplifying creative person with power tools for creativity in a portable way. Not a dumb machi…

This looks to satisfy all your requirements from your original post: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1514535-REG/sabrent_c... Its ~2 cubic inches and doesn't dangle on a cable so you don't need a table/lap. As for your more detailed post you just linked to: > Only for that purpose more ports are justified because I would prefer to have 4 at least to connect all 3 iOS devices plus hard_drive for backup etc. If…

>This looks to satisfy all your requirements from your original post:

Thank you for the link. Unfortunately it only looks so.

It satisfies only partly because it's still headache to remember where it is, remember to take it and when something like that sticks out of your machine probability to break it when there are people around is very high and not unusual. Also you can tilt accidentally your laptop and it cat potentially break the port completely.

With all that said the reality now for instance that it is simply not available in the country I am right now unfortunately. I cannot move because of the covid situation and I am limited with what I can order. My MacbookPro has died gracefully (you can read how if you wish: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25809097) I have managed to get M1 machine but now I'll have to deal with adapters that are available around.

Because I do not have sd-card-slot my photography is limited to zero currently until I find adapter that would work. I have additional headache to choose one that works, and they lie about the specs and you never know what you get so this is the reality of all those theories about 'oh you can get a dongle'.

I just wish to add that when you are really mobile and travel in different countries it is Not unusual situation. Even if it's developed country it's not easy to order something in a small town or even in a big town. Usually small towns do not have something you need, you can count on that. Probably you can buy a new Mac probably like I did but it's M1 with 2 ports and some nice adapters will be not available there. Again this is the reality , not the theory where you can access everything you need whenever you need it.

The second item you've mentioned is nice. Thank you again. It can be useful when I'll be able to reach it. Right now all my drives are usb3 to fit MacbookPro I had. This hub is also requires power supply brick as I understand and again it would be simply impossible to get the hub you've mentioned where I am at the moment.

So in my case it will be huge adapter hanging on wire and let us pray it will work as expected.

>Surely you're not suggesting that laptops built in 2021 should have a VGA port?

No, I am not suggesting that. HDMI an micro-sd-card reader do not add any thickness though and are still very useful for flexibility in real world. When I took my previous Mac I thought I will not use HDMI but mobile reality made it so that at some point it was the only way I can use it and extract data from it and the external port allowed me to boot gnu/linux. The M1 Mac on the other hand become not bootable in the first day because of the bug in DiskUtility and I needed 'another Mac' to make it even bootable again so from my perspective I did not upgrade I have downgraded.

>_extreme_ niche use case [...] 99% of people For me it's not about how many people use something it's about what a portable computer allows you to do and how flexible , productive and creative you can be with that tool. I do not want to go further about what else 99% do not do ... following majority was never too exciting for me.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#968
Really interesting, but I wish the decision had been to go down the path of using AMD Ryzen rather than Intel: Cheaper, faster, and better battery life.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#969

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do I scroll a page up and down with a trackpoint (on Windows and Linux)? I've tried using a trackpoint, but the two-finger swipe up and down on a trackpad is a convenience that I cannot seem to live without.

Sure! I'm typing on this USB keyboard: https://www.amazon.com/Lenovo-ThinkPad-Compact-Keyboard-Trac... And to scroll I press the middle blue button (below space bar), and then push the trackpoint stick up/down. The mouse cursor doesn't move, and instead the OS just scrolls the window. (Fwiw I'm on Linux and this behavior just worked out of the box, for both my generic desktop w/this keyboard & Thinkpad laptop.) Oblig…

Hmm, the middle mouse button is bound to "paste text from buffer" on Linux (probably X11 more accurately), so I keep pasting random text into the edit box or terminal window. And if I click on that middle button, then change my mind about scrolling the window, then release that button, it pastes the buffer. It looks like I have to move the trackpoint just slightly to change my mind

I don't know. Maybe people can be trained to workaround all this, but it seems very fragile and unintuitive to me. If there was a way to bind the middle button to one of the modifier keys (e.g. Alt, Ctrl, Shift, Fn, Super/Window), I can see that being a better UX. Then I can hit the modifier key, then change my mind without affecting anything.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#970
post #474

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For whatever reason, I've never used a laptop that wasn't a MacBook that has had a trackpad anywhere as amazing as what Apple has done. I don't know if the problem is hardware, software, or both, but as a consumer I don't care. I'll never buy a non-Apple laptop until I can find one that has a trackpad as good or better. That's my personal requirement. On a personal laptop I always use the trackpad so I want it to be…

I really don't get what is so special about all of these trackpad debates. Honestly if my trackpad can do a 2 finger scroll I'm happy. Worst trackpad I've used was on my x201, and was only terrible because it was tiny and insensitive.

It's very simple. Use an MBP for a few months, then switch back to another laptop and just see how long you last. I never used a trackpad at all until I got an MBP - always a mouse. Can't go back to that now. The one on MBP feels like a finely tuned instrument that does exactly what you mean it to do.
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