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Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

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Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#551

Post by amelius »

jaywalk wrote: post #539
amelius wrote: post #535

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least give me the choice. Like a switch in the settings screen saying "let Apple police me and others". I would even be ok with it being ON by default.

That's... literally what Apple is doing. Facebook is crying because they know that a lot of people will opt out of the tracking when given the choice.

Oops. Yes. But Apple is not applying it consistently. They are still policing us in a lot of different ways too. One of the many examples is that Firefox is forced to use webkit on iOS, and nobody is allowed to have their own web rendering engine in the app store, which goes right against the principles of general purpose computing and having control over your own device. It's nice that Apple has a content-filter for people who are not tech-savvy, or for kids who are not allowed to see certain content, but that filter should be optional.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#552

Post by jaywalk »

amelius wrote: post #551
jaywalk wrote: post #539

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's... literally what Apple is doing. Facebook is crying because they know that a lot of people will opt out of the tracking when given the choice.

Oops. Yes. But Apple is not applying it consistently. They are still policing us in a lot of different ways too. One of the many examples is that Firefox is forced to use webkit on iOS, and nobody is allowed to have their own web rendering engine in the app store, which goes right against the principles of general purpose computing and having control over your own device. It's nice that Apple has a content-filter for…

Ok, so you want Apple to allow iOS to be completely open. That's obviously not gonna happen.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#553

Post by firephreek »

"Personalized Ads for Small Businesses" What a bunch of malarkey. I've worked in ad space and the actual ability for SB's to compete is laughable. Their budgets are so comparatively small that they simply don't get the assistance necessary. They're drinking through paper straws while the big dogs swim in lakes.

SB's absolutely need a platform to compete, but I'm absolutely incredulous that FB is that platform, much less Google or any other like company.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#554

Post by mikestew »

nerbert wrote: post #109
fairity wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple's TOS surrounding this change prevent any sort of content-gating of this sort. Infractions may result in removal from the app store.

I'd be curious to see whether apple has the balls to remove fb from the app store

Apple pulled FB's enterprise cert a while back, basically pulling FB's internal apps offline. I don't think it's a huge leap to pulling the app from the App Store if it comes down to it. In fact, I'd argue that pulling the cert was a shot across FB's bow: "oh, you think we don't have the balls, do you? Anything else you think we don't have the testicular fortitude for?"

https://blog.malwarebytes.com/security-world/2019/01/apple-p...

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#555

Post by firephreek »

goatsi wrote: post #499
tmccrary55 wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny how a link to Facebook's recent data selling scandal, in a discussion about whether Facebook sells data, gets voted down.

Because that wasn't a data selling scandal? Cambridge Analytica didn't buy data on millions of people from Facebook, they harvested it for free due to lax permissions.

"I didn't pay for sex your honor, I simply left money on the nightstand."

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#556

Post by NoodleIncident »

michaelbuckbee wrote: post #410
NoodleIncident wrote: post #400

> Some apps, like Facebook, allow for some data tracking to be manually disabled. But by default, it is turned on. That gives the company reams of personal data on who we are and what we are doing, which it then vacuums up, packages and sells. Facebook would be giving away money if they ever actually sold your data. As everyone here knows, they use that data to target the ads that they sell. Do journalists phrase it…

I think there's room to be charitable and that most people don't see a meaningful distinction between "sell ads based on your data" and "sell your data to people to use in ads".

That's a circular argument. If journalists actually understood the distinction and explained it, more people would see the distinction after reading their articles.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#557

Post by rorykoehler »

kergonath wrote: post #546
rorykoehler wrote: post #506

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://9to5mac.com/2019/11/15/apple-ad-revenue/

There’s a lot of guesswork there. It’s even worse than that actually, they assume that their advertising operation will grow as Facebook’s. It is extremely implausible under current conditions (no tracking and ads limited to the stores). So yeah, if Apple were Facebook, ads would be important to them. And even the wildest estimates put it far short on the actual money maker, which is hardware sales. When push comes t…

I saw a few articles when I searched from the previous year which also projected growth to the $2b number the next year but as Apple bundles it all in services who knows?

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#558

Post by amelius »

jaywalk wrote: post #552
amelius wrote: post #551

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oops. Yes. But Apple is not applying it consistently. They are still policing us in a lot of different ways too. One of the many examples is that Firefox is forced to use webkit on iOS, and nobody is allowed to have their own web rendering engine in the app store, which goes right against the principles of general purpose computing and having control over your own device. It's nice that Apple has a content-filter for…

Ok, so you want Apple to allow iOS to be completely open. That's obviously not gonna happen.

Yes, because it's a slippery slope and I don't want to end up in a programmer's dystopian future.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#559

Post by kml »

move-on-by wrote: post #44

I don't have Facebook and I'm generally skeptical of Apple's pro-privacy messaging. However, seeing this response from Facebook has gotten me very excited for this update. There must be more to it then Apple's generic 'Most Advanced Update Ever' marketing. I'm still skeptical of Apple's commitment to privacy, but I'm certainly happy to get this update. Apple should thank Facebook for the free marketing.

It's one giant fighting another. Apple wants to destroy ad revenue and shift everyone to a paid App model because Apple can get its 30%. I bet you if Apple loses control of the AppStore for anti trust reasons, they would be all for ads.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#560

Post by mewpmewp2 »

whoisburbansky wrote: post #27
jahlove wrote: post #4

> Some apps, like Facebook, allow for some data tracking to be manually disabled. But by default, it is turned on. That gives the company reams of personal data on who we are and what we are doing, which it then vacuums up, packages and sells. My understanding is that Facebook does not sell this data, but rather lets advertisers create hyper-targeted ads, which are only possible because of this data. Edit: Certainly…

It's a nice bit of semantic ju-jitsu to say "they take this data and sell a service that wouldn't be possible without it" isn't the same as "selling this data," isn't it? Especially given that the targeting mechanisms don't have any k-anonymity guarantees, and I'm aware of at least one paper showing information leaks through the ad portal [1] https://www.ftc.gov/system/files/documents/public_events/122...

Selling data implies to me that in exchange for money they give actual data row by row to third parties.
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