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Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

casparwre.de

101–110 of 401 posts

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#101
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tracking is not just about improving conversions. It's primarily about understanding if your ads worked. It doesn't matter how good your product is if you can't tell anyone about it, and you can't spend a bunch of money telling people about it if you don't know which ad networks are giving you bang for your buck.

I think you're being silly. As long as your product is good enough, no one needs a marketing budget or to measure if marketing is working. And everyone has the resources and time to make their own analytics tools, if they need it, instead of relying on existing solutions

Are you being facetious?

Everyone has the time to roll out their own analytics? Where do you work, Google?

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#102
post #26
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Here's a crazy idea: Don't use analytics at all but focus on your product. If your success relies solely on "improving conversions" by tracking your users and then changing the position and color of your "Checkout" button then maybe try setting yourself apart I am very much onboard with this idea. The notion that it is a requirement that businesses track individual customers’ actions in order to succeed is pervasiv…

Disclaimer: I hate Google Analytics because I hate Google, I hate monopolies, and I hate excessive hoarding of user data. I think the necessary aspects of tracking can be maintained without having all the bad aspects, but we need to break up the ad companies first. > without watching exactly how every customer looks at shelves This is absolutely not true. Do you have experience with managing brick and mortar stores?…

Brick and mortar companies develop product placement and display strategies based on focus group research, not by spying on their actual customers.

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#103
post #26
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Here's a crazy idea: Don't use analytics at all but focus on your product. If your success relies solely on "improving conversions" by tracking your users and then changing the position and color of your "Checkout" button then maybe try setting yourself apart I am very much onboard with this idea. The notion that it is a requirement that businesses track individual customers’ actions in order to succeed is pervasiv…

Disclaimer: I hate Google Analytics because I hate Google, I hate monopolies, and I hate excessive hoarding of user data. I think the necessary aspects of tracking can be maintained without having all the bad aspects, but we need to break up the ad companies first. > without watching exactly how every customer looks at shelves This is absolutely not true. Do you have experience with managing brick and mortar stores?…

Rewards programs are opt-in. Stores have even stopped harassing me to sign up.

Analytics are the equivalent of a computer following you around the store, watching what you look at, how long you look at it, what you pick up, what you pull out of your cart and put back...

I’ve never in my life gotten message from the grocery store saying, “Hey, we saw you were looking at grapefruit. Here are some other citrus fruits we think you might like.”

I’ve never in my life had a store send me a message offering to sell me all the items I abandon in my cart on my last trip.

There is certainly data brick and mortar are looking at and it is often intrusive and creepy. Still, they weren’t doing this a few decades ago and they were fine. They’re pointing at online stores and saying “But it’s the only way we can survive!” It’s almost bizarre to point back at the more expensive, often first-party controlled, less accurate solutions of brick and mortars and say, “But they’re doing it too!”

(This problem is compounded when this data is given freely to a third party who now has much more data than even the individual stores or websites.)

All this adds no benefit to me as a customer. Lower prices are not a benefit if I’m also being psychologically influenced to spend those savings and more on something else.

Online or offline, I don’t care. Stop doing it. It’s creepy and unethical. It’s a waste of resources that could go towards giving me better products or a better experience. It’s the equivalent of cops asking for back doors in encryption schemes because it makes their jobs easier. If businesses can’t find a way to stop doing it themselves than I think maybe we need some regulation.

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#104
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tracking is not just about improving conversions. It's primarily about understanding if your ads worked. It doesn't matter how good your product is if you can't tell anyone about it, and you can't spend a bunch of money telling people about it if you don't know which ad networks are giving you bang for your buck.

I think you're being silly. As long as your product is good enough, no one needs a marketing budget or to measure if marketing is working. And everyone has the resources and time to make their own analytics tools, if they need it, instead of relying on existing solutions

>As long as your product is good enough, no one needs a marketing budget or to measure if marketing is working.

Let's say you make an incredible mousetrap, better than any before. Then you tell some people about it, they buy it, and stop thinking about it because it isn't central to their existence.

You've now saturated your market and have no ability to expand easily without putting effort into marketing or advertising. How do you go from there to 10 million units sold without a marketing budget of any kind?

What about if the package is extremely off-putting to people outside your culture or if the language on it is confusing. How do you know without measuring?

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#105
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tracking is not just about improving conversions. It's primarily about understanding if your ads worked. It doesn't matter how good your product is if you can't tell anyone about it, and you can't spend a bunch of money telling people about it if you don't know which ad networks are giving you bang for your buck.

I think you're being silly. As long as your product is good enough, no one needs a marketing budget or to measure if marketing is working. And everyone has the resources and time to make their own analytics tools, if they need it, instead of relying on existing solutions

You do realize that SEO to rank in search results and posting on social media (or hacker news) about your product is marketing? Without marketing how do people find your product?

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#106
Google analytics is great. It has its issues, but overall 1. They've built a working product that is easy to connect and use 2. It fits to a lot of use cases and barely has issues 3. Easy to start using, no engineering overhead 4. I don't understand what the author trying to say. Should google be a charity? Or should they stop making good product? Or does the author want to cover the cost of all the other product that is built by google? Google is more broad. They think of all the users, not just corporations.

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't use analytics at all but focus on your product. Huh? Analytics is how you focus on your product. By instrumenting your product with analytics, you can find out if customers are using your new useful feature or if they can't find it. If they're performing a task quickly because it's easy, or slowly because they're struggling with the UX. And you find out that customers on a certain mobile device are suffering…

Yes, but analytics is also used to trick folks into buying a paper back full of shit. A good product, that does what it advertises, does not need analytics. But a bad product, that somebody desperately wants to make successful, or at least successful enough to sell to a PE and exit, needs analytics.

The problem is that when making a product you're often wrong, what you think is a good product is often a bad product, or it's a nearly good product with a couple of fatal flaws that can only be seen in hindsight. S

While some people have an uncanny sense of vision, and seem hit on the right ingredients more often than seems fair, but most companies aren't led by this kind of person.

You need things that tell you when and how to course-correct, this is what analytics gives you. Now, of course, this needs to be balanced against privacy concerns. I push back on things that track literally everything (the tools that record every click and cursor movement are fascinating, but undeniably creep), and I try to avoid sending any PII to 3rd-parties. The amount of stuff Google Analytics phones home about by default is also pretty troubling.

I'm on board with basically every privacy-based criticism of tracking, but I don't buy this argument that only bad products benefit from it.

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#108
post #78
post #3

Here's a crazy idea: Don't use analytics at all but focus on your product. If your success relies solely on "improving conversions" by tracking your users and then changing the position and color of your "Checkout" button then maybe try setting yourself apart such that customers want to buy your product even despite an obnoxious purchasing flow. Only then start optimizing it. More serious thoughts: Google Analytics i…

Let's think about it. Are games doing analytics? Games are essentially UIs that people pay for the privilege to use. Although I am sure that contemporary game makers use analytics to understand user behaviour and optimize for in game spending and engagement, at least in the bigger games probably the core experience comes from creative human processes. The more the analytics the further optimised the game would be tow…

Yes games are doing analytics.

What do you think half of the achievements are for in a game - a very primitive form of analytics. There is usually an achievement for making it past the first level or prologue, there's another one for finishing the game, and probably many more for passing stages of the game. These are all to see how many people progress that far in the game.

Apart from that there's also crash telemetry and other event based tracking included in games.

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#109
post #3

Here's a crazy idea: Don't use analytics at all but focus on your product. If your success relies solely on "improving conversions" by tracking your users and then changing the position and color of your "Checkout" button then maybe try setting yourself apart such that customers want to buy your product even despite an obnoxious purchasing flow. Only then start optimizing it. More serious thoughts: Google Analytics i…

> Here's a crazy idea: Don't use analytics at all but focus on your product. If your success relies solely on "improving conversions" by tracking your users and then changing the position and color of your "Checkout" button then maybe try setting yourself apart such that customers want to buy your product even despite an obnoxious purchasing flow. Only then start optimizing it.

Here’s crazy idea for early humans - don’t use fire to cook your food. If your health depends on cooking meat, instead of hunting only for the healthy, bacteria and parasite free ones, then you should first focus on getting only highest quality meat, and only then figure out what to do with it.

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#110
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disclaimer: I hate Google Analytics because I hate Google, I hate monopolies, and I hate excessive hoarding of user data. I think the necessary aspects of tracking can be maintained without having all the bad aspects, but we need to break up the ad companies first. > without watching exactly how every customer looks at shelves This is absolutely not true. Do you have experience with managing brick and mortar stores?…

Rewards programs are opt-in. Stores have even stopped harassing me to sign up. Analytics are the equivalent of a computer following you around the store, watching what you look at, how long you look at it, what you pick up, what you pull out of your cart and put back... I’ve never in my life gotten message from the grocery store saying, “Hey, we saw you were looking at grapefruit. Here are some other citrus fruits we…

> Analytics are the equivalent of a computer following you around the store, watching what you look at, how long you look at it, what you pick up, what you pull out of your cart and put back...

I hate to break it to you, but that's already happening too. Many retailers are using NFC/RFID + door scanners combined with CCTV and computer vision to track exactly these sorts of things, as well as patterns of flow. Retail store layout is a critical part of product placement optimization and is used to create particular flows through the store. The most blatant example of store layout controlling flow is how an IKEA is designed, however these things are used very heavily in grocery and mixed retail spaces (Walmart, Target).

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