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Amazon Sends ‘Vote No’ Instructions to Unionizing Employees

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Re: Amazon Sends ‘Vote No’ Instructions to Unionizing Employees

#21

Ugh, this is disgusting and so patronising. Edit: Also, why are "union avoidance consultants" a thing? The US needs to fix its culture around unions. That's absolutely wild.

It has been a ebb and flow [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_union_busting_in_...], but in general it’s fair to say that Unions won the battle in Europe and lost it in the United States.

Lots of analysis could be done around the macro-socio-economics of the why, but in general I believe it’s because of the availability of remote, work starved populations, historically concentrated capital, and ease (from a cultural and legal perspective) of moving businesses and doing intracountry trade, have meant there was generally always a place industry could move, get what they want (including cheap labor), and sell to the same customer base or maket. Labor loses a lot of power when the company can just up and go somewhere else. This has historically been harder in Europe due to historically hard border controls and strong national identities - it will be interesting to see how this shakes out in the EU!

This is obviously not absolute (or Labor would not have gotten the power it has now, which is still non trivial in the US), but it is much more the case than Europe, where Labor has been able to dictate terms for awhile, and movements related to this problem were major contributors to the world wars.

One could also make arguments around shortage of labor in Europe due to deaths from the many world wars (which had only a minor impact on the US), or the world wars weakening the established sources of Capital or control in Europe more than the US, or shifts in population phenotypes due to mass migration to the Americas and susceptibility to certain types of working conditions or living styles (are children of folks who immigrate for work more like to move for jobs and take harsh living conditions as part of the deal?).

Overall, it’s hard to not notice that no one seems to actually be enforcing labor laws designed to protect workers, or that Labor isn’t organizing effectively and using it’s muscle. That may be changing, but especially on the low end it seems kinda unlikely right now.

Re: Amazon Sends ‘Vote No’ Instructions to Unionizing Employees

#22
post #4

Detailed, 6 step instructions on how to open a ballot and mark no? Thanks, amazon. This is almost as scummy as asking the city to change traffic lights so union organizers have a harder time talking to workers in between shifts. https://www.al.com/business/2021/02/jefferson-county-now-say...

I think an important detail that's needed here is how long the traffic back up issue has been a problem and when amazon requested it be change. If this has been an issue for years and amazon only recently requested the change, that's pretty scummy.

“This action was taken on Dec. 15, 2020 after being notified by Amazon of traffic delays. The action taken is routine for traffic signal operations, in that signal timing plans are adjusted to be as efficient as possible.” Doesn't say how long it was a problem though.

Re: Amazon Sends ‘Vote No’ Instructions to Unionizing Employees

#23

Ugh, this is disgusting and so patronising. Edit: Also, why are "union avoidance consultants" a thing? The US needs to fix its culture around unions. That's absolutely wild.

The US has had an "us vs. them" mindset towards unions since the 19th century: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_union_busting_in_th...

Back then, titans of industry hired Pinkertons to attack and kill striking workers. Now, they buy media companies and tech companies that are designed to incentivize viewers to violently threaten the politicians and organizers who support striking workers. It's the same continuum, just evolved in subtlety.

Re: Amazon Sends ‘Vote No’ Instructions to Unionizing Employees

#24
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"As a trillion dollar company we can't afford better working conditions and pay for you"? The only reason Amazon raised their fulfillment pay was because Bernie Sanders shamed them into it [1]. [1] https://www.google.com/search?q=amazon+bernie+sanders+pay

I don't expect people to agree with their case, but they should get to make it.

They've had plenty of time to change their behavior. The issues are well known at this point.

Re: Amazon Sends ‘Vote No’ Instructions to Unionizing Employees

#25
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't expect people to agree with their case, but they should get to make it.

By making any case other than robust worker rights and fair compensation, they have demonstrated their culture and priorities as a corporation. But, by all means, I agree that one shouldn't stop their enemy when they're pointing a gun at their feet (edit: to clarify, this implies Amazon is making a strategic failure by fighting unionization efforts, at it reflects poorly on them).

You're hyperbole strikes me as ... kinda out there. Not sure anyone has guns pointed at anyone in this case.

Re: Amazon Sends ‘Vote No’ Instructions to Unionizing Employees

#26
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"As a trillion dollar company we can't afford better working conditions and pay for you"? The only reason Amazon raised their fulfillment pay was because Bernie Sanders shamed them into it [1]. [1] https://www.google.com/search?q=amazon+bernie+sanders+pay

I don't expect people to agree with their case, but they should get to make it.

> I don't expect people to agree with their case, but they should get to make it.

Yeah, though the problem is that "case" is likely professionally polished FUD (if American Factory is any guide) hammered home in mandatory meeting after mandatory meeting. It's like if every voter was required to attend mandatory info sessions by Republican advocates for 20 hours in the two weeks before an election, while listening to the Democratic advocates was voluntary and optional.

Re: Amazon Sends ‘Vote No’ Instructions to Unionizing Employees

#27
post #8

Call me crazy but I think the employer should get to make their case too.

Read TFA - it's not just that Amazon is encouraging workers to vote no, they've set up mailboxes on-site that they're encouraging people to send their ballots with, making union organizers wary that Amazon is trying to keep tabs on who votes, even though it's supposed to be anonymous.

Re: Amazon Sends ‘Vote No’ Instructions to Unionizing Employees

#29

Amazon's tactics in response to unionizing efforts been extremely revealing. Even if unionizing fails, I'm happy that it forced Amazon to show us all the level of contempt they have for their workforce.

Every corporation has contempt for its workforce, it's why labor unions are so necessary.
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