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The unusual ways Western parents raise children

bbc.com

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Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#391

Post by meowster »

watwut wrote: post #303
meowster wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I volunteer with a U.S. Scout troop. I see boys that don't know whether or not they can go on an activity/campout because they have to ask their parents if they're free that day/weekend. I try to tell them their old enough (most are teenagers) that they should start deciding for themselves what activities they participate in. Most all of them just seem apathetic. I'm sure their parents are trying to do what is best f…

There is nothing new in that? When I was pre teen and teen, I definitely had to get parents permission for weekend campout. It seems to me normal that parent have a say in whether the non-adult child sleep at home. Plus there were weekend activities woth familly I was expected to participate in - trips, familly visits, grandpa birthsday, etc. So I would ask. I mean, idea that 16-17 years old goes for campout without…

I don't know, my parents always asked me if I wanted to go to my Grandmother's house or other trips (I did).

I always just told my parent that I was doing something just so they knew where I was - not necessarily asking for permission, but that gave them the chance to veto it (which they only did one time as punishment when I got in trouble at school).

I think that parents need to teach their kids how to be responsible and autonomous, and treat them like they are their own person, because they need to be to have any chance at being successful.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#392

Post by bluGill »

Aunche wrote: post #340

One thing that I find weird about the Western (perhaps just American) way of raising kids is that the retired population is surprisingly uninvolved in the raising of their grandchildren. It seems like an economic inefficiency when parents are spending so much money on childcare while old people are feeling increasingly lonely.

There are a lot of grand parents involved in the young, then the kids grow up and teens just don't need as much time and so the grand parents are lonely. There are a lot of lonely great-grand parents that someone fit into this. There are a lot of people who don't live close to the grand parents (but may have a sibling who does).

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#393

Post by astura »

bhandziuk wrote: post #248
ragnese wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm in the U.S. I personally know a non-trivial number of women who have gone through absolutely intense (real, diagnosed) anxiety and depression because of having to feed formula to their child instead of breast milk. If you ever get to peek into these "mommy groups" on social media or in person, you can see how much shaming goes on in there. And the breast milk one is one of the biggest issues people get shamed for…

When my wife and I went to pre-baby classes they'd often use the phrase "Fed is best" and I thought it was strange because it sounded like something that could have rhymed and was a missed opportunity. Then I was informed that the phrase used to be "Breast is best" but, like you're saying, women who could not breast feed for whatever reason were subjected to this level of guilt and ridicule so much so that now they'v…

Skin-to-skin is totally BS nonsense. It was found to be beneficial for premature infants who need help regulating body temperature in low resource settings (where incubators are not available). So naturally, people started recommending it for term infants who don't need help regulating body temperature and it's risks completely ignored!

https://www.skepticalob.com/2019/04/fisher-price-rock-n-play...

https://www.skepticalob.com/2016/01/overselling-the-benefits...

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#394

Post by thombee »

dom96 wrote: post #297
mucholove wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What method of sleep training did you use? This article lists 6! https://www.todaysparent.com/baby/baby-sleep/most-popular-sl...

I've been wondering the same, the BBC article explains: > the most extreme version of which involves leaving a baby on their own to "cry it out", in an effort to encourage their babies to sleep for longer stretches so their parents can get some much-needed rest. I'm not a parent but that sounds pretty sensible to me. Odd of the BBC to call it "extreme".

The baby is crying because they want attachment to the parent. Give them the love they want. Don't deprive them of love by letting them cry it out. Comfort them!

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#395

Post by thombee »

lqet wrote: post #145
alistairSH wrote: post #29

Of all the "weird" things we do as parents in euro/anglo nations, sleeping arrangements seems nowhere near the top. IMO, the top "offender" is over-scheduling kid's activities. So many kids in my area have their days booked solid with sports, academic tutoring, music lessons. Approaching zero free time to enjoy being a kid. Edit - and this isn't really a western thing, "Tiger Mom" and similar probably pre-dates this…

Not so sure this is necessarily a western thing. When I was a kid in Germany in the 90ies, school started at 7:30, and ended at 13:00. Once a week you had afternoon school from 14:30 to 16:00, and my parents wanted me to have piano lessons once a week. But after 13:00, and on weekends, I was generally free to do whatever I wanted. I played computer games excessively and watched a lot of movies, of course, but I also…

Isn't Germany western?

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#396

Post by kinghtown »

eurusdac wrote: post #214
gdubs wrote: post #171

One of the hardest thing about being a parent today is the constant shame and confusion about the “right” way to do it. We don’t live in a hunter gatherer society anymore, we just don’t. There’s lots of wisdom in that way of life, and sure we could learn from it — but there’s enough anxiety as it is, parents don’t need more of it. We have three kids and we sleep trained them. (Not a pediatrician, standard disclaimer.…

I agree, my advice to any new parent would be to listen carefully to advice about how not to drown your child while bathing them, and how to make sure they're not suffocated by their bedding. Both real issues where some simple practices avoid the small risk of an absolutely catastrophic outcome. Then take all other advice with a pinch of salt. Just follow your best instincts and do what seems right. Your child will b…

Father here. I agree.

So much of the parenting advice I see dips into micromanaging and min/maxing to an almost paranoid degree. Just learn about what could kill them in the first year and avoid that. Really, six months and under is the true window for SIDS with freak occurrences. Definitely be on the lookout for any poisonous cleaning products While you’re at it and put them high off the ground.

The pro parents who did it all before you are super annoying. I’ve had to politely listen to questionable advice many times. I much prefer people like you who get it. You got to trust your instincts about your own kids. There is broad advice which applies to everyone but everyone’s kid is a little different from the norm as well and as a parent we know our kids better than anyone else.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#397

Post by secabeen »

a2tech wrote: post #380
JKCalhoun wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For myself, the risk SIDS didn't even enter my calculus. (I confess I am a little skeptical that it exists at all.) Regardless, I perceived the emotional bonding with the mother & father to far outweigh anything else and so we shared our bed with our children until they were perhaps 1 year old or so. And even after, they moved into their own small bed just a foot from ours in the same bedroom for another year or so.…

I very much believe SIDS is a real thing. I also think that many cases of SIDS are babies being smothered by soft cloth that bunches up and constricts their breathing and by accidentally smothered by their parents while they're deeply asleep. When kids are small I think co-sleeping is a great thing (where you have a small basinet or something similar next to your bed where you can reach out and touch your baby but th…

> accidentally smothered by their parents while they're deeply asleep

This seems unlikely. 10% of babies share a sleep surface with parents, up from 6.5% in 1993, yet SIDS deaths are down over the same period:

https://www.webmd.com/baby/news/20180212/baby-suffocation-de...

https://www.cdc.gov/sids/data.htm

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#398

Post by eecc »

jimbob45 wrote: post #282
agumonkey wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are in an orthodoctic era. Lots of tensions about what principle is the best to follow, less patience and acceptance.

Would you please define that word? I can't find a definition online and I try to look up unfamiliar words to widen my vocabulary.

I’ve heard of the word “orthorexia”

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#399

Post by ksd482 »

Aunche wrote: post #340

One thing that I find weird about the Western (perhaps just American) way of raising kids is that the retired population is surprisingly uninvolved in the raising of their grandchildren. It seems like an economic inefficiency when parents are spending so much money on childcare while old people are feeling increasingly lonely.

Good point. I am an Indian, raised in India, came to US at 19.

I notice the same thing here. We have neighbors who are white and have their grandkids over every day. It is very refreshing to see.

However, it is a rare thing to see at the same time. I have never seen other native born Americans talk about their grandkids or heard of them being involved in their upbringing.

I am cautious of the stereotypes such as when they retire, they just want to be left alone, travel and not be bothered. But the stories where they end up in old age homes while their children are fully grown adults and successful, are far too often. This doesn't make sense to me because on one hand they would look forward to their children and grandchildren visiting them in their old age homes, on the other hand they don't want to live together.

Sure, I am fine with the idea "if it works for them, then good for them", but it doesn't seem to work for them.

So to summarize, I think the American culture is still trying to figure itself out. Perhaps things would fall into place in a generation or two after learning from other cultures (and of course, other cultures learning some good things from American culture).

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#400

Post by meowster »

ivanbakel wrote: post #275
meowster wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> each additional worker can create opportunities for further additional workers By more people working, we created more opportunities for more people to work? I think there is a fallacy within that "lump of labour fallacy". I'm not saying there is a fixed amount of work needed, but eventually you do run into economies of scale: less and less addional work is needed to support more people. Hasn't cost of living and o…

>By more people working, we created more opportunities for more people to work? Yes, because more workers = more people with money = more people who stimulate production through spending. The issue with the "economies of scale" argument is the same issue that the original lump of labour argument has - it assumes that there is a sensible upper bound on the amount of work people want done at any one time. The only reas…

> By more people working, we created more opportunities for more people to work?

What I was getting at, is that it sounds like the goal is just to work for the sake of working.

(I should have put an elipsis after "to".)

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