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Coca-Cola says 'Be Less White' learning plan was about workplace inclusion

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Re: Coca-Cola says 'Be Less White' learning plan was about workplace inclusion

#91

Post by seneca »

germinalphrase wrote: post #70
uxcolumbo wrote: post #35

Is there a definition of what it means to be white (or any other color for that matter)? EDIT: to the down voters - this is a serious question. First we need to know what DiAngelo means with being white. The statement 'be less white' implies that all white learners of her course exhibit some negative traits. What are those negative aspects? How else can you change if you don't know what you're doing wrong in her eyes…

One of the big problems with this entire conversation is the definition of terms. The word “white” has been defined hundreds of ways within the “woke” literature and multicultural academics - some of them having no connection to skin color. The nuance and depth of thought that has gone into these academic discussions is elided and you end up with “be less white” which is clearly and obviously inflammatory to a whole…

You're correct, but I think you're missing that this is done intentionally. I've heard it referred to as "humpty-dumpying", referring to the character is Through the Looking-Glass:

> "When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean—neither more nor less." "The question is," said Alice, "whether you can make words mean so many different things." "The question is," said Humpty Dumpty, "which is to be master—that's all."

It's equivocating and a preemptive setup for a Motte and Bailey. You can then say blatantly racist things like "be less white", the Bailey, and when called on it, retreat to "oh well when I say white I don't mean white, I mean ", which is the Motte.

If it weren't intentional there would be very little reason to recycle words that already have established meanings and use them to mean something that doesn't explain the meaning with nuance, but supposedly changes it entirely.

Re: Coca-Cola says 'Be Less White' learning plan was about workplace inclusion

#92

Post by underseacables »

LinkedIn takes it down but who was ultimately responsible for it? The fact that it has Coca-Cola‘s logo on it to me seems to be that Coca-Cola paid for this training, or at the very least endorsed it. It would be highly unethical and possibly illegal to just slap a company’s logo on a presentation even if it was recommended to their employees. I think we do need training in how to work together better regardless of background, but I think a better approach would have been to talk about ethics, values, and treating one another with respect, forgiveness, and fairness.

Just be kind to one another!

Re: Coca-Cola says 'Be Less White' learning plan was about workplace inclusion

#93

Post by alea_iacta_est »

inglor_cz wrote: post #89
alea_iacta_est wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nigerian Americans have on average 10 % higher incomes than whites. I'd love to know the source on that, thanks.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_groups_in_the_U... It is not surprising. Immigrants from Nigeria are the best educated immigrant group and income correlates with education.

I agree with you, thanks for the source.

Re: Coca-Cola says 'Be Less White' learning plan was about workplace inclusion

#94

Post by Minor49er »

inglor_cz wrote: post #74

Imagine "Be Less Black", "Be Less Jewish", "Be Less Native American", "Be Less Inuit". Neoracism. We need a word that captures the essence of such thinking and "neoracism" is a good candidate.

What's the difference between "racism" and "neoracism"?

Re: Coca-Cola says 'Be Less White' learning plan was about workplace inclusion

#95

Post by newmnhn »

rayiner wrote: post #71
newmnhn wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"White" isn't a racial group. "White" as an idea to describe a group of (roughly) light skinned European people, came about in order to justify enslaving and subjugating other groups. Various groups worked their way into being considered white over time, in part by contributing to the subjugation of others. And various groups once considered white, later were not considered so. "White" as what you call a "social grou…

> "White" isn't a racial group. I understand the academic underpinnings of that idea, but that's not how normal people understand the term "white." The Bureau of the Census, for example, certainly appears the believe that "white" reflects a racial category: https://www.census.gov/topics/population/race/about.html .

Sure, but the history of the term matters in this context & maybe should be taught a little more. Like when we grow up these days, we sorta get the idea that White or Black are these inherent traits that people naturally have and have always had.

We rarely get the chance to see that the idea of whiteness comes from a need of protecting an in-group from exploitation, while excusing and justifying the exploitation of outsiders to that group.

The census is an interesting example because for the first 70 years or so, starting in 1790 the US census had just 3 "race/ethnicity" categories. You could be "Free white male/Free white female", "All other free person" or "Slave". Which is part of the reason for creating the category of whiteness. There's also some really gross stuff right through the 1800s where the census was tracking people with various percentages of "black blood".

https://www.pewresearch.org/interactives/what-census-calls-u...

I suppose I'm just saying that the census, as part of the machinery used to implement and maintain white supremacy, is not necessarily the best authority on race.

Re: Coca-Cola says 'Be Less White' learning plan was about workplace inclusion

#96

Post by tolbish »

inglor_cz wrote: post #78
rayiner wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Racial inequality is not an "artificially inflated issue." Studies show that, despite reduction in de jure racism over the past 70 years, Black-white income gaps are large (with Black incomes being 19 percentile points below white incomes in the income distribution), and also persistent. Meanwhile, the incomes of other groups (Latinos, Asians) have or are in the process of converging with those of whites. So there is…

There are fairly massive income gaps within white and black groups as well. Nigerian Americans have on average 10 % higher incomes than whites. EDIT: It is 5 per cent, not 10 per cent. I was mistaken. They have 10 % more than an average American household. Czech Americans have on average 20 % higher incomes than generic whites. Given that I am a Czech, are we silently running Czech supremacy in the U.S.?

I wonder why HN only focuses on the financial part. There are several complex ways in which racial injustice works. Nigerian Americans will still get racially profiled at the store and have a harder time with the police.

Re: Coca-Cola says 'Be Less White' learning plan was about workplace inclusion

#97

Post by Hydraulix989 »

ceilingcorner wrote: post #65
Sparkle-san wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You make it sounds like non-American countries are going to take over America and then then rule over it with an iron fist. That being said I don't know how you'd create "real value" on top of what Coca-Cola does. They put sugar into water and sell it at absurd mark-ups.

I’m amazed that there is so much to do at Coca-Cola. You’d think by now the entire company would be a technician, a taste tester, and a marketer + an army of machines.

Or an army of marketers

Re: Coca-Cola says 'Be Less White' learning plan was about workplace inclusion

#98

Post by inglor_cz »

Minor49er wrote: post #94
inglor_cz wrote: post #74

Imagine "Be Less Black", "Be Less Jewish", "Be Less Native American", "Be Less Inuit". Neoracism. We need a word that captures the essence of such thinking and "neoracism" is a good candidate.

What's the difference between "racism" and "neoracism"?

The same as between Nazism and neo-Nazism. Not much in essence, slightly different mimicry, identical roots.

Re: Coca-Cola says 'Be Less White' learning plan was about workplace inclusion

#99

Post by inglor_cz »

tolbish wrote: post #96
inglor_cz wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are fairly massive income gaps within white and black groups as well. Nigerian Americans have on average 10 % higher incomes than whites. EDIT: It is 5 per cent, not 10 per cent. I was mistaken. They have 10 % more than an average American household. Czech Americans have on average 20 % higher incomes than generic whites. Given that I am a Czech, are we silently running Czech supremacy in the U.S.?

I wonder why HN only focuses on the financial part. There are several complex ways in which racial injustice works. Nigerian Americans will still get racially profiled at the store and have a harder time with the police.

I cannot vouch for that either way. My experience from Europe is that A LOT depends on your clothing and general demeanor.

An Indian dressed a in silk three piece suit and a Philippe Patek watch on his wrist will be treated with obsequious deference by the store personnel. A Roma guy dressed as stereotypical Roma will be suspected and followed. Their skin colors are identical.

At the end of the day, money talks.

Re: Coca-Cola says 'Be Less White' learning plan was about workplace inclusion

#100

Post by ephemeral54321 »

rayiner wrote: post #49

I first heard this notion of trying to "be less white" in the context of Robin DiAngelo: https://www.aei.org/op-eds/anti-racist-education-is-anything... . I found it alarming, but people assured me she was just a crackpot. To see such rhetoric become normalized enough to be presented in training materials for a Fortune 500 company is truly disturbing.[1] Rhetoric like this is deeply problematic, especially for mixed-…

I agree with your points completely, though DiAngelo is not white. She is the daughter of two Ashkenazi Israelis.
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