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Bitfinex and Tether required to end all trading activity with New Yorkers

ag.ny.gov

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Re: Bitfinex and Tether required to end all trading activity with New Yorkers

#401

Post by kragen »

mancerayder wrote: post #399
kragen wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you live in a country with a highly functional banking system and no kleptocracy, Bitcoin is probably a bit puzzling unless you have family in Cuba. But it's not puzzling at all for those of us who live somewhere in the middle of the broad spectrum between Switzerland and Somalia, because most places have a little kleptocracy. Argentina is far from being "a failed state," but if you want to send US$500 abroad via…

You should publish this someplace. This perspective is never mentioned in the mainstream outlets, even if it's pro or neutral on BTC.

Everyone is free to redistribute my comments in this thread, in whole or in part, modified or unmodified, with or without credit; I waive all rights associated with them to the maximum extent possible under applicable law. Where applicable, I abandon their copyright to the public domain. I wrote and published these comments in Argentina in 2021.

http://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/zero/1.0/

Re: Bitfinex and Tether required to end all trading activity with New Yorkers

#402

Post by ad31mar »

yabudemada wrote: post #293
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cryptocurrency isn’t the only way to escape USD inflation. Investors have been investing to avoid inflation long before Bitcoin was invented. Investing in virtually any asset other than cash will, almost by definition, shield you from inflation. Inflation is an increase in asset prices, resulted in reduced buying power. You only need to invest in assets (stocks for example) and minimize holdings in cash if your goal…

This is why I think the proper crypto currencies are backed by another functional use instead of "just coins." (e.g. Ethereum vs. Bitcoin)—one is a useful Turing-complete machine; the other only exists to send coins. Bitcoin will probably always outshine the other "just coins" because it was the first. Why get another coin if this one works fine for monetary transactions? Similarly with the functional ones: Ethereum…

> Ethereum will probably always outshine the other "Global Turing Machines" because it was the first. We don't really need another one—assuming it can adapt to changes in efficiency with hard-forks as needed.

We didn't need the first one.

Re: Bitfinex and Tether required to end all trading activity with New Yorkers

#403

Post by microtherion »

ffggvv wrote: post #223
deanmoriarty wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s your recommendation for least-worse inflation hedge?

Buy the swiss franc. Or TIPS. or a commodities etf. or emerging markets etf as EM does well when dollar is weak. (their loans are dollar denominated)

The Swiss would appreciate if you did NOT buy Swiss francs as an inflation hedge. This kind of speculation hurts our export industry.

Re: Bitfinex and Tether required to end all trading activity with New Yorkers

#404

Post by jcranmer »

nemo44x wrote: post #313
mumblemumble wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This statement, minus the political content, sounds very, very, very similar to what I was hearing about tech stocks a bit over 20 years ago, and houses about 15 years ago. Maybe that means something, maybe it doesn't. If I had some way of knowing, I'd have a lot more money than I am now. It's worth remembering, though, that prices are just that: prices. Nothing more, nothing less.

Yeah me too - I remember when AMZN was $2. I remember when AAPL was 28 cents (before splits, etc). I remember when the Internet had a host of pundits proclaiming it was a dying fad in 2001. And most anyone who bought a house at the peak of the bubble is doing quite well if they still have it today.

The counterpoint is Japan: its economy peaked around 1990, and still hasn't recovered to that level, 30 years later.

Re: Bitfinex and Tether required to end all trading activity with New Yorkers

#405

Post by mastermojo »

tim333 wrote: post #379
dudus wrote: post #272

I've been following Tether for quite a long time. I have no absolute proof it is a scam but the writing is on the wall. Here are some facts. - The current Market Cap of USDT is 34 Billion Dollars. It was 4B this time last year. Since the value is pegged this means there has been an influx of cash of 30 B into this shady company in the last year alone. Who invested this money? We have no idea since Tether doesn't disc…

>There's no way to transfer USDT into USD Use Kraken. You can change USDT to USD and withdraw money. I've done both.

This is the confusing part to me. Everything I read online talks about Tether being fraudulent. Shouldn't the price of Tether reflect a discount based on that? If it doesn't, does that mean the market is okay with a Tether being 1 USD even if it is not backed by anything?

Re: Bitfinex and Tether required to end all trading activity with New Yorkers

#406

Post by dcolkitt »

tutfbhuf wrote: post #305
dcolkitt wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's no way to transfer USDT into USD. The few exchanges that say they offer withdraws actually don't if you go and try. There is an easy way. Swap USDT to USDC on Curve. Deposit USDC on Coinbase. Convert USDC to USD on Coinbase. Withdraw USD. I'm not saying I disagree with your overall thesis. But this specific point makes it sound like USDT is some sort of roach motel ("you can get in, but you can't get out").…

> There is an easy way. Swap USDT to USDC on Curve. Deposit USDC on Coinbase. Convert USDC to USD on Coinbase. Withdraw USD. Then what is your explanation for why it is not possible to directly exchange USDT for USD, there must be a reason that no exchange wants to do that. > that most of the market doesn't perceive a risk. That is absolutely no indicator for safety.

> That is absolutely no indicator for safety.

Currently, several billion in value is locked into Defi-based liquidity pools with USDT. If USDT collapses tomorrow, the stakers will lose nearly all of their principal. (Fast traders will quickly swap worthless USDT for all the USDC in the pool, before hardly anyone has time to remove liquidity.)

The largest of these pool, currently pays about 2.6%.[1] Even if all of that return reflects USDT credit risk, that market implies a 1/50 chance of USDT collapsing within the next year. I'm not saying the market is necessary correct. But what I am saying is that very deep, liquid markets are not pricing any significant USDT risk.

If you really disagree, you can even short USDT, by borrowing USDT on Compound at 4.2%. Then use that to buy USDC and supply it on Compound at 4.9%.[2] If USDT collapses, you'll make nearly 100% as you'll only have to buy back now worthless USDC. In fact the market will even pay you take this position, with the only risk being if USDC collapses relative to USDT.

[1]https://www.curve.fi/3pool [2]https://compound.finance/markets

Re: Bitfinex and Tether required to end all trading activity with New Yorkers

#407

Post by WrtCdEvrydy »

hntrader wrote: post #380
_jjkk wrote: post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some believe this is an intentional Ponzi scheme to print some money for the owners of Tether and Bitfinex, others believe they had good intentions at first, but through bad investment or otherwise got underwater, and started "investing" their USDT-backing dollars to claw back up. Bitfinex originally denied relation to Tether but it's been proven that was a lie. The worry is, at some point there could be a "run" on T…

Another dumb question: If they've been buying assets like BTC using the USD that they were supposedly keeping as reserves, shouldn't they have made massive amounts of profits since 2018, and be in a position to now return the USD reserves so that it's 1:1, while keeping billions in profits for themselves?

You couldn't liquidate that much BTC without tanking the markets... it's a game of chicken if it's true that the USD backing tether is gone.

Re: Bitfinex and Tether required to end all trading activity with New Yorkers

#408

Post by Guvante »

vmception wrote: post #290
dudus wrote: post #272

I've been following Tether for quite a long time. I have no absolute proof it is a scam but the writing is on the wall. Here are some facts. - The current Market Cap of USDT is 34 Billion Dollars. It was 4B this time last year. Since the value is pegged this means there has been an influx of cash of 30 B into this shady company in the last year alone. Who invested this money? We have no idea since Tether doesn't disc…

Almost all fiat deposits into Bitfinex create USDT. Thats an additional fact that the amount is in line with the amounts that would be deposited into any big exchange. If Coinbase minted USDC whenever someone deposited, you would see the same kind of growth. The basis of your entire post is assuming impropriety based on pretty normal behavior with the addition of the business quirk of when USDT is created. The abilit…

Their post doesn't describe normal behavior. It describes what would be illegal behavior elsewhere. It may be somewhat legal depending on the underlying reasons due to the quirks of not being regulated but renegading on promises to investors is not normal behavior when it comes to things like audits.

Re: Bitfinex and Tether required to end all trading activity with New Yorkers

#410

Post by T0Bi »

mcintyre1994 wrote: post #370
dudus wrote: post #272

I've been following Tether for quite a long time. I have no absolute proof it is a scam but the writing is on the wall. Here are some facts. - The current Market Cap of USDT is 34 Billion Dollars. It was 4B this time last year. Since the value is pegged this means there has been an influx of cash of 30 B into this shady company in the last year alone. Who invested this money? We have no idea since Tether doesn't disc…

> There's no way to transfer USDT into USD. The few exchanges that say they offer withdraws actually don't if you go and try. So what actually happens when people sell Bitcoin? They get USDT on an exchange and then can never get cash out? Is there some convoluted series of trades you can make from USDT -> ??? -> USD or something instead? And people selling Bitcoin have made enough profit to just ignore the overhead o…

OP got that wrong. It's very simple to exchange USDT for USD, you can do it on Kraken and Binance and withdraw to your bank account. No problem at all
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