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Perseverance rover’s descent and touchdown on Mars [video]

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Re: Perseverance rover’s descent and touchdown on Mars [video]

#71
Observations

Open source bits and shout out:

  - The rover has an Intel-based PC running Linux.
  - The video is compressed using FFmpeg.
  - https://youtu.be/gYQwuYZbA6o?t=4027
Images and Video and Data!

  - 30GB of data. 23 000 images
  - https://youtu.be/gYQwuYZbA6o?t=562
Cam Fail on Descent:

  - 1 of 3 cameras failed when the mortar/parachute fired.
  - Some other items were damaged/disrupted during the firing as well – not desired, but expected
  - https://youtu.be/gYQwuYZbA6o?t=615
Parachute + Secret Message:

  - When packed, the parachute has the same density “as oak”.
  - it trails at about 150 feet.
  - The parachute pattern detail is intentional – sections to assist tracking different portions, etc.
  - There appears to be some sort of secret message encoded in the parachute: “sometimes we leave messages in our work for others to find…give it a shot and show your work”
  - https://youtu.be/gYQwuYZbA6o?t=1174
  - see also https://twitter.com/lqqkout/status/1363982243010473986
Mic Fail on Descent:

  - They did not get audio from the port-side EDL mic on descent due to a analog-to-digital comms malfunction
  - specifically stated that it was not a hardware issue.
  - https://youtu.be/gYQwuYZbA6o?t=3518
Other Descent Things + Sky Crane:

  - The heatshield is aeodynamically stable and does not tumble/spin on ejection.
  - No plumes from the ‘sky crane’ because the exhaust products of hydrazine are hydrogen and nitrogen.
  - The only hint that the rockets are firing are the slight colour change due to the heat (pink tint).
  - The photos/videos are the first views of the sky crane in action because it’s not something that can be tested on earth.
  - The photos/videos from the sky crane looking down at the rover at transmitted to the rover via an ‘umbilical cable’
Comms and photo things:

  - The High-gain antenna has only now been deployed. That’s the one that allows the high speed 2mbps rover-to-orbiter link.
  - https://youtu.be/gYQwuYZbA6o?t=2039
  - The data rate changes depending on the different orbiter being used.
  - “return 500-900 megabits per pass” and 2-3 overflights per night.
  - https://youtu.be/gYQwuYZbA6o?t=3928
  - And some of the biggest data relays were via European/ESA Trace Gas orbiter.
  - https://youtu.be/gYQwuYZbA6o?t=4097
The pieces:

  - There’s a shot of all the pieces and their landing/crash sites as taken from orbit. Heat shield, perseverance, back shell, descent stage/sky crane, parachute.
  - https://youtu.be/gYQwuYZbA6o?t=2251
Mic + Hardware things:

  - There are two mics. One captured some audio on the surface. A gust of wind. (more interesting to me was the hum of the rover). It would be cool if the audio from the mics could be used to pair with the panoramic view to create spatial audio.
  - https://youtu.be/gYQwuYZbA6o?t=2333
  - Because the EDL mic is ‘off-the-shelf’ it is expected to fail quickly in the Mars environment. They have no immediate plans to use it for any kind of diagnostics during its lifetime.
  - https://youtu.be/gYQwuYZbA6o?t=4215
Camera + Hardware things:

  - The cameras used are off-the-shelf commercial hardware with some modifications. Purchased from Point Grey Research (which was acquired by FLIR Systems).
  - Most interesting mod: they had to replace some materials that could off-gas in space/vacuum and potentially deposit on the detectors.
With all that, these press conferences are so weird. They still use a lot of acronyms. The setup is strange when there's no actual audience in front of them. They don't actually answer the questions from the press sometimes. They attempt to describe aspects of videos/images ("on the right you can see an antenna") instead of using technology to actually show. It's not quite clear who the audience is here: they're combining questions from kids and the press. It would be helpful if they annotated images. It would also be helpful to place the questions on screen (who has asked them). But, still so damn exciting.

//edit, formatting

Re: Perseverance rover’s descent and touchdown on Mars [video]

#72
post #52
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be great to see some startups work on interplanetary video streaming tech. If you're building an other video streaming service, stop what your doing, and give this a try. I know I know. Very, very hard to solve and all, and this is totally a fanboy speaking, but it would have been awesome if we could have seen this footage in (as close as possible to) real-time when the landing happened.

So, the minimum delay between Mars and Earth is around 11 minutes, usually higher. And the bandwidth is something like 60 MiB/Sol. This is just totally unrealistic with any known tech for the foreseeable future

Current delay is ~11 minutes, but minimum is much lower (~4 minutes, per https://blogs.esa.int/mex/2012/08/05/time-delay-between-mars... ). We were last at that closest point in October, and the various voyages (this one, UAE's Hope, China's Tianwen-1) were timed so the closest pint was during the transit; we're a bit past it now.

Re: Perseverance rover’s descent and touchdown on Mars [video]

#73

Can someone comment on why this is the first time I'm seeing videos from Mars versus previous missions. Did the memory write speeds increase, more sensitive CCD sensors, easier to send data back to Earth? I'm sure there must be some technological reason this wasn't done before because it's simply stunning...

One thing to consider is that NASA missions are basically always using older technology, because by the time the mission gets approved, designed, and built consumer/business tech has already moved past. Space worthiness ads more 'age' to the technology as well.

Re: Perseverance rover’s descent and touchdown on Mars [video]

#74

Can someone comment on why this is the first time I'm seeing videos from Mars versus previous missions. Did the memory write speeds increase, more sensitive CCD sensors, easier to send data back to Earth? I'm sure there must be some technological reason this wasn't done before because it's simply stunning...

The current scale of video availability is very recent. Dirt cheap tiny HD cameras and storage & fast reliable networking to match, are only a few years old. Put that in context of a complex system expected to work perfectly under extreme conditions millions of miles distant, with early designs starting years ago, and that’s why you’re only seeing such now.

Re: Perseverance rover’s descent and touchdown on Mars [video]

#75

Can someone comment on why this is the first time I'm seeing videos from Mars versus previous missions. Did the memory write speeds increase, more sensitive CCD sensors, easier to send data back to Earth? I'm sure there must be some technological reason this wasn't done before because it's simply stunning...

Not an expert, but my sense is that it's at least in part due to widespread cheap/commodity consumer cameras becoming a thing between the planning of Curiosity and the planning of Perseverance. In earlier missions, cameras were usually big and bulky and designed specifically for their respective research functions, and if you're designing something from scratch, you design it to maximize research utility first, and sending home cool videos is probably a secondary consideration. So I'm not sure many of these could do video (because it's probably not that useful for studying rocks that don't move), and a lot of them didn't even capture a spectrum range exactly matching the visible range (I think some of them included parts of the near-IR range, etc.), so a lot of the images from earlier missions that were released to the public had color that was faked/recreated in post-processing.

I think the new rovers still have these specialty cameras, but now that there are decently good mass-market cameras from the cellphone/consumer-electronics industry that cost $5 apiece and weigh a couple of grams, it seems like there's no reason not to throw a few of those onboard as well.

I would speculate, also, that video compression might be part of the story. Processors on these vehicles tend to be specialized radiation-hardened chips that are modified versions of several-generations-old general-purpose processors. I think Curiosity's was a rad-hardened 200MHz PowerPC chip, for example. I would bet that those chips just weren't up to the task of compressing high-quality video enough to make it practical to send, given the bandwidth constraints of transmitting from Mars to Earth.

Re: Perseverance rover’s descent and touchdown on Mars [video]

#76

Can someone comment on why this is the first time I'm seeing videos from Mars versus previous missions. Did the memory write speeds increase, more sensitive CCD sensors, easier to send data back to Earth? I'm sure there must be some technological reason this wasn't done before because it's simply stunning...

It didn't have priority until now. Everything costs time and money and adds more complexity, more parts that can cause a failure. While videos are nice, they don't have such scientific value as another scientific instrument that could have been on board instead.

Re: Perseverance rover’s descent and touchdown on Mars [video]

#77

Can someone comment on why this is the first time I'm seeing videos from Mars versus previous missions. Did the memory write speeds increase, more sensitive CCD sensors, easier to send data back to Earth? I'm sure there must be some technological reason this wasn't done before because it's simply stunning...

One thing to consider is that NASA missions are basically always using older technology, because by the time the mission gets approved, designed, and built consumer/business tech has already moved past. Space worthiness ads more 'age' to the technology as well.

I remember when New Horizons flew by Pluto in 2015 taking pictures with a 1 MP camera. At that time I had an 8 MP camera on my phone, but remembered that in 2006 when New Horizons launched, the iPhone didn't even exist.

Re: Perseverance rover’s descent and touchdown on Mars [video]

#78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was hoping for the same, but at 9.5km away, and with a decelerating speed of 150m/s we wouldn't see but only a pixel. I wonder if they have the time/it's in their plan to send the bot over to record where it landed, the state that it's in, etc. If they want to simulate assess the damage, it would be cheaper to make heat shield 50 of them on Earth and drop them from 10-15km. I assume that every minute is gold and th…

> I wonder if they have the time/it's in their plan to send [Perseverance] over to record where [the heat shield] landed I was thinking the same, but more for the fact that surely the impact has made a hole of some description that could be interesting to look into. Take advantage of the already expended energy to penetrate the surface layers.

But it would be contaminated, toxic and dangerous for the rover (it would contaminate or damage the instruments). Not worth it.

Re: Perseverance rover’s descent and touchdown on Mars [video]

#79

As it got closer to the ground, it seemed really hard to get a sense of scale with that downward camera. It felt like the ground just kind of "appeared" right before the sky crane did its thing. How big are the rocks under it? It felt like they were either big (1+ meter) or just little pebbles. I really couldn't tell. Either way, this is seriously the coolest video I think I've ever seen. I cannot wait for more.

At about 2:57 the operator says the rover is about 20 meters off the surface, if that helps at all. I agree it got really hard to get a sense of the scale once the thrusters started blowing up dust.

I rewatched listening to all that and it helped but only in an abstract way. It's like there needs to be a penny in the shot or something to get a sense of scale.

Re: Perseverance rover’s descent and touchdown on Mars [video]

#80

There have been made tremendous steps in simulation software. The fact that the crane mechanism has never been tested on earth besides simulations is incredible. Always wondered what software they use. Do they have a generic platform to run simulations on? Or is every mission written from scratch?

Not quite, the sky crane method was also used for Curiosity rover back in 2012
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