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Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

1b677b8f8bb20100.github.io

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Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#31

Post by barbacoa »

tovej wrote: post #6

"You see, freedom of speech and expression must be absolute." That's pretty extreme. First, freedom of speech is not freedom from consequence of speech. And second, freedom of speech only applies to public forums. Why would a private enterprise need to put up with someone spreading vitriol and fake news? Let's say I own a mall, and you rent a store in that mall. You suddenly decide that you are going to start selling…

People do have free speech rights at private owned malls. Not sure if that would apply to stores but courts have ruled it does apply to people at malls (and other public areas that are privately owned).

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pruneyard_Shopping_Center_v....

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#32

Post by haram_masala »

jimbob45 wrote: post #12
gchamonlive wrote: post #4

In a tolerant society, should we tolerate intolerance? I am genuinely interested to hear your thoughts.

Every piece of speech is intolerant to someone out there. The mistake is thinking that any bit of speech is empirically tolerant or intolerant.

This is an interesting line of thought, which I don't know if I agree with or not. It might be worth exploring the contrapositive: "If a piece of speech is tolerable to at least someone, then it shouldn't be censored."

And that raises an absurd but still interesting thought experiment: if by some process, someone is able to create a statement that is intolerable to every single person on Earth, would it be okay to censor it?

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#33

Post by bilbo0s »

ThomW wrote: post #9

Parler is a shit hole, and at this point I’m not sure we need another social network anything. The major ones do a lousy job of policing fake news and misinformation, and from your tone it sounds like you support that garbage. I’m pretty sure giving every moron on earth a globally-accessible soapbox is about the stupidest idea humankind has ever had.

Who was the guy who said, "There's no such thing as a 'stupid' idea, only great ideas that go horribly wrong."

It's all about the context, and having the requisite creativity to see the drawbacks on the horizon.

I think social media and surveillance marketing are good examples of what he was probably talking about. (Actually, IIRC, the quote was in relation to dating strippers, but you get the idea.)

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#34

Post by bpodgursky »

arkitaip wrote: post #5

"You see, freedom of speech and expression must be absolute." This is a very ignorant take on freedom of speech and a terrible foundation for your project.

"Thou shalt not kill" is also an absolute bedrock principle which is, of course, impossible to literally always follow.

But it's still a very important guidepost around which to orient your principles.

"Freedom of most OK speech is absolute" is a useless principle. Which is why we should not frame the freedom of speech as such.

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#35

Post by undefined1 »

arkitaip wrote: post #5

"You see, freedom of speech and expression must be absolute." This is a very ignorant take on freedom of speech and a terrible foundation for your project.

“To suppress free speech is a double wrong. It violates the rights of the hearer as well as those of the speaker. It is just as criminal to rob a man of his right to speak and hear as it would be to rob him of his money.”

― Frederick Douglass

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#36

Post by tovej »

jimbob45 wrote: post #18
tovej wrote: post #6

"You see, freedom of speech and expression must be absolute." That's pretty extreme. First, freedom of speech is not freedom from consequence of speech. And second, freedom of speech only applies to public forums. Why would a private enterprise need to put up with someone spreading vitriol and fake news? Let's say I own a mall, and you rent a store in that mall. You suddenly decide that you are going to start selling…

What if you exclusively kick all blacks out of your mall? Under your rules, that should be indiscriminately allowed.

My rules (society's rules) are entirely orthogonal to the issue of discrimination against groups of people.

If individuals do not follow the rules, they should be punished, that's fine. If you apply the rules differently depending on what group a person belongs to, that's not ok.

... but that has nothing to do with my comment (I can't believe I have to explain this).

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#37

Post by tclancy »

threevox wrote: post #13
arkitaip wrote: post #5

"You see, freedom of speech and expression must be absolute." This is a very ignorant take on freedom of speech and a terrible foundation for your project.

"Ignorant" == you can't be bothered to come up with a genuine refutation

Watch: this is some white dude worrying that white dudes might be silenced. Show me all the money trying to make marginalized voices heard and then you cannot fuck off into the multiverse like whichever anime show you Stan but don’t respect.

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#38

Post by anon20190221 »

endisneigh wrote: post #17

I'm surprised no one has made a truly decentralized site using webtorrent or ipfs, such that the more people use it, the harder it is to take down. I suppose databases would be hard to implement with both, but you could just save everything as updating flat files and the database could be a progressive enhancement. seems like an interesting technical problem to solve. if you're willing to trade off speed for resilien…

This project is pretty much what you are describing, only more secure and tailored for a pretty much single use case.

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#39

Post by JMTQp8lwXL »

ThomW wrote: post #9

Parler is a shit hole, and at this point I’m not sure we need another social network anything. The major ones do a lousy job of policing fake news and misinformation, and from your tone it sounds like you support that garbage. I’m pretty sure giving every moron on earth a globally-accessible soapbox is about the stupidest idea humankind has ever had.

> I’m pretty sure giving every moron on earth a globally-accessible soapbox is about the s̶t̶u̶p̶i̶d̶e̶s̶t̶ most profitable idea humankind has ever had.

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#40

Post by dkjaudyeqooe »

chrissnell wrote: post #7
gchamonlive wrote: post #4

In a tolerant society, should we tolerate intolerance? I am genuinely interested to hear your thoughts.

We should tolerate all speech. That doesn't mean you can't scream and call it hate speech, but do so from your own platform.

So if I effectively monopolise free speech by drowning out all other speech, that's ok?
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