Earlier quoted context omitted.
> It sounds as if Nano is still vulnerable to a 51% attack. Every cryptocurrency is vulnerable to a 51% attack including Bitcoin.
As much as people like to complain about Bitcoin's energy usage, it makes a 51% attack prohibitively expensive and if you were to invest all that money, you'd want to make money with it rather than cause a short term disruption to the network.
Nano is what Bitcoin hoped to be
101–108 of 108 posts
Re: Nano is what Bitcoin hoped to be
#102At the end of the day NANO is useful for me. The node's API is sane. There are no big promises, hype, gotchas or surprises. It just does what it claims to do and nothing more. If that's not what you're looking for, that's fine. I'm not selling anything. Price is not equal to value or utility. I won't argue with speculators or those who ascribe to SoV rationales. We have different expectations and that's fine. Nano wo…
I have no vested interested in any cryptocurrency, but I have been researching them in the last few months due to the bull run. The polarized views on Nano are actually what drew me to research it more in depth compared to other alt coins. My findings are quite positive. - Over the last 3-4 years the community (both of users and developers) has been chugging away consistently, regardless of bull/bear markets (somethi…
You personally, perhaps none. But, there are plenty of businesses today (Exchanges, Payment gateways, Casinos) that run nodes because they make a lot more from the profits Nano brings their business than the relatively minor cost of running a node.
None of these businesses would trust a 3rd party to tell them the network state.
As cryptocurrency adoption rises and more business start adding it as a payment option (eg. online shops) it's not hard to imagine the larger ones, eg. Amazon, would run a node rather than pay 1% fee to a payment gateway service.
It's also important to note that Bitcoin also does not provide financial incentives for running full nodes (miners != nodes) and in both Nano and Bitcoin's case, there are plenty of nodes on the network.
Re: Nano is what Bitcoin hoped to be
#103At the end of the day NANO is useful for me. The node's API is sane. There are no big promises, hype, gotchas or surprises. It just does what it claims to do and nothing more. If that's not what you're looking for, that's fine. I'm not selling anything. Price is not equal to value or utility. I won't argue with speculators or those who ascribe to SoV rationales. We have different expectations and that's fine. Nano wo…
I have no vested interested in any cryptocurrency, but I have been researching them in the last few months due to the bull run. The polarized views on Nano are actually what drew me to research it more in depth compared to other alt coins. My findings are quite positive. - Over the last 3-4 years the community (both of users and developers) has been chugging away consistently, regardless of bull/bear markets (somethi…
I prefer to frame the issue differently. Feeless, not free.
Why should I pay 3rd parties to send my own crypto to my users, from my own node? I'm already paying the hosting. It isn't free. I've invested in the server.
Fees make microtransactions impossible. Running a node gives me direct access to the Nano network.
Re: Nano is what Bitcoin hoped to be
#104Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Nano throws that away and says people will invest to protect the network just because. Can you provide sources for this claim? https://docs.nano.org/running-a-node/overview/ >Transaction fee savings for businesses and organizations accepting Nano as payment Which is why I run a node, so I can have access to the network.
>Transaction fee savings for businesses and organizations accepting Nano as payment Can someone sense check me? So following that argument, a payment processor (e.g. Amazon, Stripe, all the way down to the mom and pop stores) would be incentivized to run a node in order to accept Nano and be part of the Network. Correct? But hypothetically...if Stripe knows that Amazon is running a node, why would Stripe run its own…
Re: Nano is what Bitcoin hoped to be
#105Re: Nano is what Bitcoin hoped to be
#106Feels like Reddit is spilling into HN a bit too much, shilling cryptocurrencies so that you can sell your investment and make a large bag of cash.
Engage with good faith on the merits. Castigating those you disagree with as shills or bots isn't the start of a high quality discussion.
Re: Nano is what Bitcoin hoped to be
#107Earlier quoted context omitted.
Open Representative Voting is just a proprietary term for Delegated Proof-of-Stake (DPoS) consensus [1]. Basically transaction validator nodes are elected by votes weighted by the sum of the amount of tokens in the voters' wallet. Apparently Nano wanted to highlight the fact that anyone can become a validator instead of a preselected list by coining a new term. While better than most DPoS chains there is still a high…
Both those articles on DPoS are referring to master node type coins. Nano's model is different in a couple fundamental ways: > Block producers are those responsible for creating and signing new blocks. They are limited in number, and are elected by the voters. Nano uses block lattice so there aren't a limited amount of block producers, every account produces its own blocks on it's own blockchain. > Because the delega…
Re: Nano is what Bitcoin hoped to be
#108Long before Nano was created the XRPL team created the first blockchain (DLT) without PoW or PoS and without incentives (fees) for node operators. This lead to a new problem, spam transactions. If transactions are free nothing stops people from sending coins in circles which puts load on the network and thus costs other people real money. The 2 obvious ways to mitigate this is to either add a fee or make the sender solve a little time-consuming math problem (PoW). the XRPL devs wanted to avoid PoW for all the obvious reasons, but fees have also their downside. mainly it creates an incentive and it suddenly makes every transaction that does not include at lest X amount of fee (more than the processing cost) a "negative" Tx i.e. one that all node operators have a reasonable reason to exclude.
This kind of potentially exclude valid Tx, even if there is plenty of capacity, is bad for the network. Users loose the confidence of knowing that a valid Tx will always be included. They would need to intentionally overpay in fees. The XRPL devs decided to mitigate this by adding a fee but its burnt instead of paid to someone. By burning "money" you proof that your Tx is actually worth something to you. How much you burn is basically irrelevant. The network decided whats the minimum and as long as the network inst at full capacity the minimum guarantees that the Tx will be included by all nodes. Only if the network reaches max throughput it would priories the Tx that burn more. This way an spammer would need to send thousands of Tx every second AND each one of them must burn more than every other legit Tx is willing to burn, to stop everyone from makings Tx go trough.
Now to Nano. They had basically the same problem but choose PoW instead so they can claim its "fee-less" while in reality you pay the "fee" as PoW (energy+hardware+time). Its so minuscule that most user dont even notice that there is a PoW needed. But its there anyway and it comes with the flaws PoW has. Mainly its wasting resources and it does a objectively worse job at preventing spam.
Remember above I explained that a spammer on the XRPL would need to send thousands of Tx and burn (pay) more than every other valid Tx to block them. So the attacker has to be willing to pay more than all user combined. Nano's PoW means an attacker has to do more PoW than all legit user combined but that does NOT mean he has to pay more. PoW, unlike burning, can be optimized. Special hardware, location (cheap energy) and in general doing PoW at large scale, allays will be way way more efficient than what each legit user does.
If thousand user do a total of 1000 Tx and it costs them 0.1 cent (PoW) combined then a single user doing PoW for 1000Tx can certainly do it for way way less then 0.1 cent.
However if 1000 user do a total of 1000 Tx each burns 0.0001 cent (total 0.1 cent) there is no shortcut. A single user would have to burn exactly the same 0.1 cent no way to optimize.
Another negative effect of PoW is that it is not future proof for low-power device. Imagine some kind of smart sensor or other IoT device that does Tx. It has some tiny tiny "CPU" that may be able to do the PoW for a Tx in a reasonable time. But what about in 10 years? The PoW per Tx inevitably has to rise over time. Compare that to burning X times more in fees per Tx 10 years from now - doesn't matter the tiny "CPU" will work exactly the same. (yes, I know you could offload the PoW to another device yada yada yada but K.I.S.S.)
tl;dr: Nano made a bad decision to make transaction "fees" be paid in PoW for the "benefit" of calling it fee-less.