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I don't know, Timmy, being God is a big responsibility (2007)

qntm.org

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Re: I don't know, Timmy, being God is a big responsibility (2007)

#151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We do have uncaused causes, but they are not God. They are fundamental processes such as radioactive decay, which occur in any particular interval of time with a certain probability, but have no cause. Sorry, Aquinas.

One response: > In particular, the critic owes us an account of why, since physics cannot in principle capture all there is to physical reality in the first place -- and in particular arguably fails entirely (as Russell held) to capture causality in general -- we should regard it as especially noteworthy if it fails to capture causality in one particular case. If the critic, like the early Russell, denies that there…

But this introduces at least one more premise before we get to Aquinas' conclusion: the premise that "physics cannot in principle capture all there is to physical reality".

And that is not enough, as even if it could be sustained, Feser is still arguing from a generality to a specific. Physics might fail to capture all there is to physical reality while it also being the case that atomic decay is acausal.

Furthermore, when Feser writes: "In short, anyone who claims that quantum mechanics undermines Scholastic metaphysical claims about causality owes us an alternative worked-out metaphysical picture before we should take him seriously", he is just attempting to shift the burden of proof away from those on whom it properly rests: those who say that they can prove there's a God.

Then there's the straw man "If the critic, like the early Russell, denies that there is any causality at all..." that we need not waste any time on.

- And that's all just from the short quote you have provided!

What Feder is not delivering here is an argument that the decay of an atom had a specific cause that operated at a specific time.

Aquinas at least has the virtue of being straightforward, but there's still the independent issue of the unstated assumption that I raised earlier.

Re: I don't know, Timmy, being God is a big responsibility (2007)

#152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One response: > In particular, the critic owes us an account of why, since physics cannot in principle capture all there is to physical reality in the first place -- and in particular arguably fails entirely (as Russell held) to capture causality in general -- we should regard it as especially noteworthy if it fails to capture causality in one particular case. If the critic, like the early Russell, denies that there…

I had read it before, and I skimmed it again just now. I think this is just Feser redefining cause so that its meaning is so broad as to have practically no content, and to make the claim that everything must have a cause trivially correct. The cause for the decay of the atom is now whatever made the atom, or inherent in the atom’s existence or nature. This does nothing to change my description of the decay event as…

...and let's add virtual photons and other particles to the set of events that two millenia of metaphysics never imagined.

Re: I don't know, Timmy, being God is a big responsibility (2007)

#154
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been an avid fantasy fan since forever, but I'm a relative latecomer to sci-fi novels. I recently finally completed making my way through all of the Culture novels - thoroughly enjoyed every one, and was kind of sad to have reached the end! Have you come across any other sci-fi authors that approach the style of Ian M. Banks? Otherwise, any recommendations for other sci-fi with the depth that the Culture series…

Charles Stross.

Agreed. I’ve just gotten well into singularity sky, and the Eschaton and it’s fantastic computational powers reminds me of the minds of the culture. Although I guess I am holding out hope the Eschaton has a good sense of humor if it ever shows up in person in the plot. I always got a kick out of culture mind/ship names, philosophy, banter, and such.

Re: I don't know, Timmy, being God is a big responsibility (2007)

#155
post #98
post #90

Good lord the prose is gawd awful. Almost parody levels of tediousness.

I don't quite agree, but this is very early qntm. You might appreciate his later work. https://qntm.org/mmacevedo

My aversion to this as fiction is there is so much attention to the fictional science and so little to the fictional people. I could just go read futurist prognostications to get the tech part without having to wade through what reads like the proceedings of the IEEE. It's the typical glaring fault of bad sci-fi: it paints the tech photorealistically but paints the people like cartoons. It bores me to tears.

Re: I don't know, Timmy, being God is a big responsibility (2007)

#156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as sci-fi goes, the entire Culture series is about the sum of my experience, and I thoroughly enjoyed it all. I read Liu Cixin's Three Body Problem a few years back, but didn't like the writing style (I know of course it was a translation), and much of the story seemed implausible even in the world that was created. IIRC, I couldn't bring myself to complete the series. If it helps, some fantasy authors I like…

Well, you've got your epic fantasy, and your personable... Dan Simmons (Hyperion saga, Olympus), Rameez Naam's "Nexus". Nick Harkaway's "Gnomon" is ridiculously good, and I basically buy anyone who wants one a copy of Cory Doctorow's "Walkway". Theodore Sturgeon is probably the closest SF I can think of to Pratchett, although he's Golden Era so suuuuper soft SF and doesn't have the humor. Bujold's "Vorkosigan" saga i…

> Nick Harkaway's "Gnomon" is ridiculously good

You are the first person I've ever seen to mention that book. It is astonishingly and unreasonably excellent, and I recommend it every chance I get. I'm just beginning my first re-read now.

Re: I don't know, Timmy, being God is a big responsibility (2007)

#157
post #99
post #13

Ian M. Banks novel “surface detail” comes to mind. Please note it is better than the tawdry wiki write up. Somehow, it gets similar points across — similar to this essay, but deeper in feeling. Let me also say the authors here have done really well with so short a format. To paraphrase my toddler son, I want more story!

I've been an avid fantasy fan since forever, but I'm a relative latecomer to sci-fi novels. I recently finally completed making my way through all of the Culture novels - thoroughly enjoyed every one, and was kind of sad to have reached the end! Have you come across any other sci-fi authors that approach the style of Ian M. Banks? Otherwise, any recommendations for other sci-fi with the depth that the Culture series…

I have nothing to add beyond the great recommendations you've already been given, but I'm throwing in an enthusiastic +1 for Diaspora and Gnomon. Quantum Thief, and Harry Potter And The Methods Of Rationality, are also great.

Re: I don't know, Timmy, being God is a big responsibility (2007)

#158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The author is being slightly inconsistent, with respect to the other premises of the story, in saying there is a feedback loop: as it is set up, simulations have no causal power in the world running them. If the top-level 'God' people choose to run the simulation faster than real-time, I think we can say that no change will be observable anywhere in the simulation stack, except that the people in them will feel as th…

> The author is being slightly inconsistent I agree, and I'm not sure the scenario given could happen. The basis of the possibility of the scenario is "the universe is deterministic" and "we have infinite computing power" - but then, is the infinite computer itself part of the universe? b/c as soon as the top layer interacts with the sims, it diverges, which means the sims are not the same as the top layer anymore, s…

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Re: I don't know, Timmy, being God is a big responsibility (2007)

#159
post #155
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't quite agree, but this is very early qntm. You might appreciate his later work. https://qntm.org/mmacevedo

My aversion to this as fiction is there is so much attention to the fictional science and so little to the fictional people. I could just go read futurist prognostications to get the tech part without having to wade through what reads like the proceedings of the IEEE. It's the typical glaring fault of bad sci-fi: it paints the tech photorealistically but paints the people like cartoons. It bores me to tears.

If you're referring to the story wging just linked, I suspect you may have skimmed it or missed the point of it. The story is entirely human-focused, and the dry "IEEE" style is an intentional rhetorical device, reflective of the text's status as a "future document", designed to convey a certain social attitude. A similar idea forms the basis of a typical SCP story.

Re: I don't know, Timmy, being God is a big responsibility (2007)

#160
post #140
post #101

I do not quite understand how the guys in the simulation can determine which level they are at. If L1 universe interferes with L2, will the guys in L2 see the divergence in L3? How do they determine their own level? Fantastic story. Will read more from this author!

I think it'd work like this: Imagine you decide to show a "1" instead of the black sphere. You then look behind you. Most likely you see a 1. Whatever number you see, increment that number by one in the next simulation. If you see nothing, congrats, you're at the top and leave the number as-is. So initially what each level sees is behind them is: x-1-1-1-1-1 Then after everyone increments by one: x-1-2-2-2-2 Now repe…

That makes perfect sense. Thanks for the excellent explanation, Nition!
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