Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think most companies that already decided on the electron UX vs dev effort tradeoff will happily trade user resources for a guaranteed, uniform browser version target. It makes a big difference in development and testing.
Yea, but as a user, it's disappointing, and kind of impossible for me to push back on this trend. I can avoid using these apps, but it's an impotent show of protest. It won't make a difference. User experience, native look and feel, and the user's RAM are all being sacrificed on the altar of More Comfortable Developer Experience.
Tauri: An Electron alternative written in Rust
411–420 of 438 posts
Re: Tauri: An Electron alternative written in Rust
#412Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Electron gives the promise of total code re-use across platforms which is what makes web technologies more suitable for desktop apps. I am not sure what the point is of Electron: a shitty-resource hungry app that literally is a wrapped web-app. Instead of writing platform specific apps that leverage the power and capabilities of those platforms, we get a jack of all trades and master of none. Electron is a business…
> Instead of writing platform specific apps You've answered your own question as to why people write then. > What value does electron add to the user? It adds a lot of value to Linux and to a lesser extent Mac users: before a electron a lot of apps didn't have a version for these platform at all.
What value does _this_ add over a web app?
I've been an exclusive Linux user since college so I'm aware of the disadvantages of app/service unavailability (I remember the dark days of running Netflix in a windows VM that I barely had enough RAM to run...).
But what's the advantage of using the Slack app over a browser tab? This is a sincere question, since enough people reference the benefit of faux-native wrapped webapps that I assume there's some value.
I seem to be the only one in my company who doesn't use Slack's app, and I'm always shocked when I see a colleague's computer freeze and have them say "ugh it's almost definitely the Slack app". I work in autonomous vehicle engineering, so these are _monster_ machines I'm talking about, capable of running the entire car's stack locally. The only advantage I can think of are desktop notifications, but 1) I'm pretty sure browsers support those and 2) is that really worth using an app that's amateurish enough that it freezes your computer regularly?
Re: Tauri: An Electron alternative written in Rust
#413Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Electron gives the promise of total code re-use across platforms which is what makes web technologies more suitable for desktop apps. I am not sure what the point is of Electron: a shitty-resource hungry app that literally is a wrapped web-app. Instead of writing platform specific apps that leverage the power and capabilities of those platforms, we get a jack of all trades and master of none. Electron is a business…
Honestly, this site is the only place I really hear about the supposed horror of electron. The resource issue doesn't seem to effect me or people in the 7 slacks I'm in all day. My 6 year old MacBook runs slack, Xcode, android studio, safari, chrome, messages, vs code, vim, iterm2, preview, battle.net and hearthstone all the time without issue, really. I think for the average user, they'd rather have more features ac…
Re: Tauri: An Electron alternative written in Rust
#414Earlier quoted context omitted.
I run three browsers on my desktop, because the number of things that don't work properly in anything except recent Chrome is enough that I keep encountering issues, I don't want to use Chrome for my regular browsing, and both Safari and Firefox have issues on some sites. On my tablet, a number of current websites don't run even on Chrome, because the tablet isn't particularly new, so it doesn't have current Chrome.…
Did you try Brave? I'm yet to encounter anything that works in Chrome but not in Brave (save for the occasional site that breaks because of ad/trackblocking, which can easily be disabled)
Re: Tauri: An Electron alternative written in Rust
#415Earlier quoted context omitted.
But why would the system webview be less resource hungry? If it runs in an own process instance, the only memory you safe is (maybe) the executable code (i.e. maybe 100MB max). Or you would need some common runtime which is shared across the OS, and somehow use IPC to it. Then you can potentially save some more memory. But I don't think this exists. And I'm also not sure how much you really would save. The advantage…
100 MB / app is significant, especially on laptops. Slack used to use so much memory on Linux that I couldn't afford to run the desktop app and ran it inside a Firefox tab for years... seems to have gotten better somehow.
Re: Tauri: An Electron alternative written in Rust
#416Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Tauri doesn't and instead relies on webview, which uses a different browser engine dependent on your platform, with all the incompatibilities that come with it. Isn't windows system webview now a chromium fork? This should make incompatibility on the major platforms now much less of an issue.
People act as if they haven’t dealt browser incompatibilities in the past. Just feature-detect/polyfill and move on.
The infantilization in frontend is accelerated by its veneer of supporting Product's sole mission in life to ship products ASAP, and I fucking hate it, and I've been some frontend engineer somehwere unimportant for 5 years now.
I wager, generalizing from my quite limitde experience, that a concerning amount of frontend devs just know how to schlep bags of data around and eventually get a desirable outcome with a framework keeping things narrowly from getting out of control when they are obvious re-factors, massive simplifications, that would get just as much expressiveness with less code. You will have bossess who only understand technical discussion in the form of "what framework or library should we use for this new epic?", like, bro, let's model the problem and see what we need from there maybe before we start thinking about writing code? You can almost just ask a frontend dev, "How would you refactor this or that code? to find out if they're just a baggage handler trying to minimize any concerted thought on their part. It's like frontend is corporate's proving ground on how to flatten all thinking and passion out of software engineering
Sorry, end of rant. I came to frontend from academia naively thinking people wanted to think about problems and put effort into solutions
Re: Tauri: An Electron alternative written in Rust
#417Re: Tauri: An Electron alternative written in Rust
#418Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'll take Win95 in a heartbeat; consistent, accessible, responsive and clear. Vastly superior to the majority of web interfaces.
Also totally inflexible, you better have the right-sized screen/resolution: too small and you can't see that "ok" button; too large and you'll have a ridiculously small and crammed winform to fill/see your information.
Re: Tauri: An Electron alternative written in Rust
#419Earlier quoted context omitted.
It would be fun that Dart finally takes over Javascript this way (Flutter is written in Dart, which was originally written to be the new Javascript)
I wish the dart language was more common than typescript. but this is very hard.
Re: Tauri: An Electron alternative written in Rust
#420Earlier quoted context omitted.
Have you tried developing relatively complex UI with QT? You need to hire a team of engineers and spend man-years of effort to build custom UX that in the web / Electron can be replicated with an npm install fancy-library. Yes, I hate Electron, but the alternative is not QT; it's something like Sciter.JS with real Web API compatibility (or perhaps a stripped down WebKit2 which is much less resource-heavy).
I worked in a job where people developed very similar Qt and Electron apps, in both cases it was a one person effort and the development took about the same time.