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Margaret Mitchell fired from Google

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Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google

#21

Post by foolinaround »

rsj_hn wrote: post #15

>Unfireable save for clear violations of policies such as sexual harassment I would take a look at (and consider donating to) FIRE to understand the current state of academic freedom in universities. https://www.thefire.org/news-and-media/ Just to give two examples: Bret Weinstein was fired from Evergreen for not participating in a no-white-people-on-campus day (and he was also subject to credible death threats, requ…

considering that there are no market forces at play in the universities, it is almost guaranteed that intellectual freedom is much lesser due to the very polarizing, take no prisoners approach currently in place.

Dissent is not being tolerated, when in former times, it even used to be welcome.

Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google

#23

Post by foolinaround »

xiaolingxiao wrote: post #19

She gave a talk at my school once, she was invited by my then advisor. This was in 2017 right after she left MSR. We had a brief change, and even back then you can tell she’s not into kowtowing to the patriarchy. It’s quite hard for ambitious women in compsci, they have to walk a tight edge between firm and “motherly”. Men have no such constraints. —————————————— Clarification: I’m speaking about women researchers in…

what makes you assert that were she male, she would have gotten different treatment in this case? genuinely asking..

Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google

#24

Post by [deleted] »

foolinaround wrote: post #23
xiaolingxiao wrote: post #19

She gave a talk at my school once, she was invited by my then advisor. This was in 2017 right after she left MSR. We had a brief change, and even back then you can tell she’s not into kowtowing to the patriarchy. It’s quite hard for ambitious women in compsci, they have to walk a tight edge between firm and “motherly”. Men have no such constraints. —————————————— Clarification: I’m speaking about women researchers in…

what makes you assert that were she male, she would have gotten different treatment in this case? genuinely asking..

[deleted]

Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google

#25

Post by soheil »

> Within the next year, let those of us in positions of privilege and power come to terms with the discomfort of being part of an unjust system

If you have this pinned to your Twitter (on 2/5) about your employer why are you still working there and not resigning? It took Google 14 days to fire her, which I suppose is the typical two weeks notice since that date.

Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google

#26

Post by ggm »

underseacables wrote: post #18

She was fired for violating company confidentiality, anything she says otherwise about her gender, race, culture, etc is just a deflection, but it’s probably coming.

Do you think society at large really benefits from employers doing things this way?

If you were in the ethics department of a company, unpacked deep seated entrenched breach of social norms and were blocked from talking about it but still believed in ethics, what would you do?

I am unsure I would be prepared to do what she and Timbru did but that's a long way from the implied cynicism and also frankly abject legalistic kow-towing implicitly in your statement.

"Yea, that whistle blower had it coming, they signed the same contract i did" is pretty sad. Its not this case, sure, but its in the room, alongside sacking union organisers, refusing to approve talks, private illegal nonpoaching deals with Apple, paying your founder millions to cover up their sexualising the workforce,

Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google

#27

Post by itronitron »

rmk wrote: post #4

For people who are familiar with this, I have a question. How does research in an industrial lab vs. a university work, insofar as independence is concerned? In a university, aside from well-defined ethics guidelines for conducting research (e.g., involving animal or human subjects), staff are generally free to publish the findings of their research at any venue they see fit. Many are tenured professors, so they also…

Anyone interested in working in a research position should care a great deal that their management hierarchy is separate from their research hierarchy, and that the organization supports researchers working across teams. That will reduce the impact of personality conflicts and assholes.

I know that some places feel that the people managers have to be the technical experts but I would strongly advise against working in such a place.

Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google

#28

Post by schoolornot »

No qualms for Googlers getting a reality check. I don't get why people think they work at a liberal think-tank where no consequences exist for sharing opinions or confidential data about the company publicly. Had someone on my team decided to write a similar doc like the one Margaret published, I'd have fired them on the spot. Shut your mouth and move on if your ideology conflicts with your employer's.

Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google

#29

Post by rirarobo »

andyxor wrote: post #11
minimaxir wrote: post #2

As noted in her pinned tweet ( https://twitter.com/mmitchell_ai/status/1357819673455202304 ), she was locked out of Google's system after sending an email supporting Timnit Gebru. (EDIT: and allegations of systems abuse; see child comment) This new tweet makes the firing official.

no, she was locked out after extracting thousands of files illegally, see Google response from January: https://venturebeat.com/2021/01/20/google-targets-ai-ethics-...

That's only if you take Google's PR at face value. Also, no where in the article nor in Google's statement do they claim that Meg Mitchell did anything "illegal". I haven't seen any details about the allegedly extracted files, so I think there's more to the story.

Re: Margaret Mitchell fired from Google

#30

Post by darkarmani »

rsj_hn wrote: post #15

>Unfireable save for clear violations of policies such as sexual harassment I would take a look at (and consider donating to) FIRE to understand the current state of academic freedom in universities. https://www.thefire.org/news-and-media/ Just to give two examples: Bret Weinstein was fired from Evergreen for not participating in a no-white-people-on-campus day (and he was also subject to credible death threats, requ…

Fired?

> A settlement was reached in September 2017 in which Weinstein and Heying resigned and received $250,000 each, after having sought $3.8 million in damages.

He resigned as part of a settlement when he sued them. The university paid to get rid of him.

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