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Koo, India’s free-speech Twitter alternative

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Re: Koo, India’s free-speech Twitter alternative

#71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I share the same fear farmers have in regards to corporations taking over things. I have seen documentaries that talks about how chicken farmers are at the mercy of 3-5 corporate monopolies in USA. So I don't know if the Indian farmers fear about corporations are entirely wrong. Having said that, I think the new laws are good for India. These are the arguments I have heard in favor of the new laws: One of the main ar…

You keep using MSP, but haven't said what it is.

Minimum Support Price

Re: Koo, India’s free-speech Twitter alternative

#72
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does 'nationalism' concern you. Is 'nationalism' always or almost always negative?

'nationalism' is typically distinguished from patriotism; the latter is a love of country -- the former is the conviction that one's country is better than other countries, on the basis of a rank tribalism.

Would most people who call themselves nationalists actually accept this definition?

Re: Koo, India’s free-speech Twitter alternative

#73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I share the same fear farmers have in regards to corporations taking over things. I have seen documentaries that talks about how chicken farmers are at the mercy of 3-5 corporate monopolies in USA. So I don't know if the Indian farmers fear about corporations are entirely wrong. Having said that, I think the new laws are good for India. These are the arguments I have heard in favor of the new laws: One of the main ar…

You keep using MSP, but haven't said what it is.

Minimum Support Price. The government buys certain crops at a minimum rate from the farmers to protect them from sudden market fluctuations

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimum_support_price_(India...

Re: Koo, India’s free-speech Twitter alternative

#74
Censorship and moderation are only part of the issue. The broader issue is with the nature of these platforms being conducive to vitriol, misinformation, and a kind of image-obsession and addiction to trivial things that takes away from more important pursuits. I see no reason why this would be better than Twitter in that regard.

Also, sovereignty is a noble pursuit but I can't help but feel that "self reliance" in this regard meaning the data for indian users remains on indian data centers misses the point and ultimately doesn't go far enough. A person needs to own his own data, and these platforms need to be not localized or controlled by singular states, but rather go above and beyond and be truly open and global.

Re: Koo, India’s free-speech Twitter alternative

#76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hate speech inciting violence is what was banned not any speech.

The classic problem is, how do you define hate speech and what counts as inciting violence? Who are the people deciding such things? If you're a foreign government you do not want some committee of Bay Area Twitter employees deciding that for your national affairs.

These are great questions, and here's my attempt at answering or elaborating on them.

> how do you define hate speech

Ira Glasser explains it precisely: "When people say they want to ban hate speech, what they mean is they want to ban speech that they hate ... But if you allowed something called ‘hate speech’ to be banned, then the only important question would be ‘who decides? ... If the government is going to be the one to decide what hate speech to ban, it’s not going to be the same speech as the speech you hate, it’s going to be the speech they hate, ... It all ends up coming down to who decides and most often, it ain’t you' https://reclaimthenet.org/former-aclu-head-ira-glasser-expla...

> and what counts as inciting violence?

This is better explained by the legal scholar Jonathan Turley,

"The reason is that while the crime is not clear, the case law is. In Brandenburg v. Ohio, the Supreme Court ruled in 1969 that even calling for violence is protected under the First Amendment unless there is a threat of “imminent lawless action and is likely to incite or produce such action.”

Trump never called for violence and instead told his followers to go to the Capitol peacefully to “cheer” on those challenging the electoral votes. Such protests at capitals are common and, while reckless, Trump’s speech could as easily be interpreted as a call for protest rather than violence."

https://jonathanturley.org/2021/02/19/want-to-prosecute-trum...

Re: Koo, India’s free-speech Twitter alternative

#77
post #4

I grew up in India - nationalism is definitely a growing concern for the country IMO, more so than can be expressed online by articles such as this. And nationalism definitely has a huge overlap with hinduism in the country. Creating siloed media platforms that lets such ideas fester and grow is probably the worst thing that can happen. The thing is that even gently challenging these ideas (with some folks I know bac…

So instead of a siloed platform, you would advocate for a nation to allow tech employees in San Francisco to influence other countries' elections, censor their politicians, control their societies' discourse, decide what's allowed and disallowed, and so on? That seems like a call for external rule and a threat to national sovereignty. There are real consequences to such acquiescence. Not everyone agrees with American…

Pretty much that. Most of HN is for Cultural Colonialism, but you know when it is dressed and wrapped in human rights and other bogus shit while buying Nikes and Apples made by real slave labor.

Peak virtue signaling.

Re: Koo, India’s free-speech Twitter alternative

#78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I share the same fear farmers have in regards to corporations taking over things. I have seen documentaries that talks about how chicken farmers are at the mercy of 3-5 corporate monopolies in USA. So I don't know if the Indian farmers fear about corporations are entirely wrong. Having said that, I think the new laws are good for India. These are the arguments I have heard in favor of the new laws: One of the main ar…

You keep using MSP, but haven't said what it is.

Sorry, I just copy pasted from another post of mine where we were talking about MSP.

MSP means minimum support price. Its a guarantee from the government to the farmers that the government will buy the crop at a certain minimum price no matter the market situation is. For example, MSP for 1 kg rice may be rupees 20. If the farmers can get a higher price in the market, they can sell it at that price. But if the market price fell for some reason (over production for example), government will buy it from the farmers for rupees 20. This guarantees that the farmers will not be at a lose.

MSP made sense when India had issues with rice and wheat (the video I linked talks about its origins in India at 5:00). Since MSP is guaranteed for some crops (such as rice and wheat) and not for others (such as pulses which India has to import), farmers would naturally make more of the MSP grains.

Also, do note that the farm bills doesn't remove MSP as far as I understand. One scenario farmers argue is this: Farmers get MSP when they sell in government run markets. Now, with the new system, farmers will get more money since they would be selling directly to the companies without any middlemen. If I understood correctly, the new system removes middle men (whom I have heard makes huge profit while paying very less to the farmers). Once the farmers starts selling directly since direct sale gets them more money, no one would go to the government markets any more. So, after a couple of years, government will close those markets since they are not in use. Now, corporations will start offering lower prices to farmers, and farmers will have no place to go. This is one argument I have heard of what could go wrong. But seeing all these protests, I have been thinking why can't farmers dictate the price if they have this much bargaining power.

Re: Koo, India’s free-speech Twitter alternative

#79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The bias is against electoral manipulation and fake news. Hence the "hacked" materials removal. > The policy on “hacked” materials is a good example that was selectively applied only against one side. On the side that pushes fake news, yes. That's a good bias to have.

There were plenty of situations in which the information was clearly gained illegally (or totally made up), but since it made Trump look bad, it was allowed. His tax returns, for example. As I said, if you think one side is somehow unbiased and just, you aren’t paying attention.

Here are 11 examples of when this very thing happened, one of which is of course Trump's tax returns: https://thefederalist.com/2020/10/15/11-hacks-leaks-and-hoax...

Re: Koo, India’s free-speech Twitter alternative

#80
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A healthy nationalism is something countries should cultivate, in particular to unify disparate minority groups with the majority. A nationalism where a Hindu majority are stripping a Muslim minority of citizenship is probably not the good kind of nationalism.

That's not what is actually happening, and is a very common incorrect characterization by progressive/Western groups/others. India's Citizenship Amendment Act (CAA) grants refugee status and paths to citizenship for refugees from some of the surrounding countries, but only if they belong to certain persecuted groups. If you're a Muslim from a Muslim-majority country, then almost always you are not a refugee escaping…

If you are an LGBTQ muslim in one of those muslim majority countries you listed above then you will certainly be persecuted. A single factor should not be used to determine the refugee status of a person
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