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Don’t format a drive of M1 Macs from recovery mode

giuliomagnifico.medium.com

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Re: Don’t format a drive of M1 Macs from recovery mode

#91

Post by southerntofu »

southerntofu wrote: post #82
superhuzza wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So that they can use/sell the stolen Macbook, which is much more common than stealing a Macbook to delete the data.

What's wrong with using stolen hardware? I mean we could argue stealing is wrong, in which case we'd have to take a look at why people are stealing and from whom (partitioning of wealth) so we can find solutions. If we're not looking at the root of the problem, then we're just complicating legitimate use cases. Preventing theft is only the official argument, but it doesn't stand any form of scrutiny: as long as there…

Why downvote? Please argue with facts. Although i understand defending vendor lock-in, ecological damage, and forced sales is a hard sell... All the more when trying to protect from criticism a corporation making billions on the backs of exploited children in mines & factories.

Re: Don’t format a drive of M1 Macs from recovery mode

#93

Post by jaywalk »

southerntofu wrote: post #91
southerntofu wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's wrong with using stolen hardware? I mean we could argue stealing is wrong, in which case we'd have to take a look at why people are stealing and from whom (partitioning of wealth) so we can find solutions. If we're not looking at the root of the problem, then we're just complicating legitimate use cases. Preventing theft is only the official argument, but it doesn't stand any form of scrutiny: as long as there…

Why downvote? Please argue with facts. Although i understand defending vendor lock-in, ecological damage, and forced sales is a hard sell... All the more when trying to protect from criticism a corporation making billions on the backs of exploited children in mines & factories.

Your arguments are 100% nonsense and 0% facts, so most people will see it as a waste of time to try and have a discussion with you.

Re: Don’t format a drive of M1 Macs from recovery mode

#94

Post by tannhaeuser »

marcan_42 wrote: post #55
devit wrote: post #5

Why not just do the usual dd if=/dev/zero of= bs=1M count=1024 instead of using those weird proprietary tools?

That "bricks" your Mac, and you have to do a DFU restore with Apple Configurator 2 to recover from it. The SSD on these Macs contains system firmware, including the boot picker and recovery mode. Do not wipe the entire top-level block device. They cannot boot from external media, by design. M1 Macs are not PCs, and you shouldn't blindly apply whatever you think you know from the PC world. Their low-level design is mu…

That's scary. Back on my old PowerBook, I saw it as an advantage that OpenFirmware could boot from external devices in the most straightforward way, and could act in target disk mode, and so did Apple. Hearing of all these troubles, I'm genuinely concerned with using MacOS today because of these unknown unknowns. What's the threat that this Apple bossing is supposed to shield against that couldn't be achieved by mere disk encryption?

Re: Don’t format a drive of M1 Macs from recovery mode

#95

Post by trinix912 »

Theodores wrote: post #63

Genuine question, but do Apple users upgrade to the latest version of the OS or is that optional? Just asking for a friend.

It's optional as long as your version of macOS is supported by the apps you're using, which is usually somewhere around five years. You can then still continue to use the old version, you just won't be able to update the apps / install new ones which require the new OS version from the App Store.

Re: Don’t format a drive of M1 Macs from recovery mode

#96

Post by tannhaeuser »

m1mac wrote: post #86
wtallis wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For years, Intel Macs have been able to net boot to install the OS onto an empty drive. Did Apple ditch that functionality or move it from the firmware to a recovery partition with the M1 Macs?

From what I can tell, Internet Recovery (which downloaded a recovery OS) is gone and replaced by 1TR which is stored on a hidden flash partition. 1TR is capable of downloading the OS and installing it, so in a way it can be considered the replacement for Internet Recovery. While architecturally simpler (and probably more secure by allowing the network stack to be removed from the low-level boot infrastructure?), the…

> probably more secure by allowing the network stack to be removed from the low-level boot infrastructure

That's up for debate due to certificate expiration issues, isn't it?

Re: Don’t format a drive of M1 Macs from recovery mode

#97

Post by hnarn »

garmaine wrote: post #45
digi59404 wrote: post #25

This is because the author didn't delete the entire volume group. You have to delete the whole volume group, i.e. erase the entire drive and it's partitions to reinstall OSX. This isn't new with the M1 Macs. This has been a thing since they introduced APFS. When they went into disk utility after the cli - Then they could delete everything and kick off the OSX Install. If the APFS Volume Group still exists the install…

I bricked my first TouchBar MacBook the day I received it, trying to do a factory reset as my company's security policies demanded. Not sure exactly how I triggered that state. Thankfully Apple took it back as a return. It should not be possible to brick a device by pushing the wrong button. I was shocked that this wasn't caught by anyone at Apple before release.

> It should not be possible to brick a device by pushing the wrong button

So you think all Apple devices should be shipped without root? Or that anything disk-related should only be allowed through CLI as root?

Re: Don’t format a drive of M1 Macs from recovery mode

#98

Post by andrewmcwatters »

PurpleFoxy wrote: post #43
digi59404 wrote: post #25

This is because the author didn't delete the entire volume group. You have to delete the whole volume group, i.e. erase the entire drive and it's partitions to reinstall OSX. This isn't new with the M1 Macs. This has been a thing since they introduced APFS. When they went into disk utility after the cli - Then they could delete everything and kick off the OSX Install. If the APFS Volume Group still exists the install…

I was kind of shocked at how hard it is to factory reset a MacBook. I had one at work and I had to pass it on and the guide is a multi step process which I messed up the first time and ended up reinstalling with my user account still there. Had to start again which takes hours. Why does the recovery not just have a button called factory reset which unlinks your apple account, deletes the volume and then sets it all u…

I recall the exact same scenario you're describing, and I'm usually meticulous when I use Disk Utility.

Re: Don’t format a drive of M1 Macs from recovery mode

#99

Post by userbinator »

marcan_42 wrote: post #55
devit wrote: post #5

Why not just do the usual dd if=/dev/zero of= bs=1M count=1024 instead of using those weird proprietary tools?

That "bricks" your Mac, and you have to do a DFU restore with Apple Configurator 2 to recover from it. The SSD on these Macs contains system firmware, including the boot picker and recovery mode. Do not wipe the entire top-level block device. They cannot boot from external media, by design. M1 Macs are not PCs, and you shouldn't blindly apply whatever you think you know from the PC world. Their low-level design is mu…

Their low-level design is much closer to an embedded device like a Raspberry Pi, minus the SD card slot.

...or like a iPhone.

From that article you linked:

Some PC motherboards implement a similar feature as part of a separate chip, which can flash the UEFI firmware from a USB stick without actually turning on the motherboard normally, but this is only common in higher-end stand alone motherboards.

That might be referring to boot-block recovery, and I haven't seen any with a "separate chip" besides the dual-BIOS type; it's in the same flash (just a normally write-protected part) as the rest of the BIOS. The older ones will look for a flashable ROM image on the first floppy drive, but I'm not surprised if the newer ones will do it with USB instead.

Re: Don’t format a drive of M1 Macs from recovery mode

#100

Post by crististm »

southerntofu wrote: post #80
PurpleFoxy wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It should just ask for your Apple ID password when you do the reset. It’s not that hard. Honestly it should even be an option within the main OS

Why, though? Physical access to the hardware should prevent you from accessing existing files (encryption at rest) but should not prevent you from resetting/reusing the device. Does your fridge come with FridgeID? Or a book? Introducing such mechanisms is really hostile to users, especially poorer users of second-hand hardware who have to go through extra (shady) hoops to get a device running just because some rich S…

Yes. In a PC ecosystem this is true - physical access renders the machine in your control (modulo Intel Management System and other backdoor schemes).

For Apple, there is a different set of axioms and some people seem to agree with them.

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