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Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint

reuters.com

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Re: Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint

#621

Post by QuixoticQuibit »

arduinomancer wrote: post #607
dubcanada wrote: post #184

I can hardly wait to use Amazon App Store to install Amazon and then open up the Epic Game Store to install random game and then open up EA Game Store to install random game and then open up Facebook App Store to install Facebook and then open up the Apple App Store to install the Blizzard App Store to install Hearthstone and then go back to the Apple App Store and update the Blizzard App Store so I can get the lates…

I don't get how you can be against having more options/freedom with your device

Because I don’t use my iPhone like I use my computer (as in desktop experience). Many people like the simple, wall/garden approach to iOS.

Re: Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint

#622

Post by hajile »

valparaiso wrote: post #602
ArkanExplorer wrote: post #486

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If Apple charged a reasonable commission level - say 5-15% - these problems would not occur. 30% is completely uneconomic and drives all of the profit to the platform owner. That's why were seeing so many acquisitions. The problem here is with the 30%.

How old are you? Have you ever asked yourself "why developers went to the new and empty Apple App Store in 2008 in mature market with Nokia and others"? The answer is very simple - commissions before Apple's 30% were 50%-70%. That's why Jobs conducted that presentation with slide regarding with 30% fee - it was unprecedent for those times. Also there is also another question - how did you calculate that 5-15% is reas…

They went to the platform because the iPhone was rapidly gaining popularity and they gained access to a captive market.

Economies of scale alone indicates that if they could do the store at 30%, they could do it for far less when scaled up.

Finally, they are rather near brick-and-mortar markups for a lot of things despite not having all the extra overhead.

Re: Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint

#623

Post by nodamage »

AttakBanana wrote: post #531
ntsplnkv2 wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is short-sighted. The App Store is good because it is closed and curated. That's a main driver of the product experience. Removing the App Store irrecoverably damages the iPhone - a curated, non-malware infested, high quality phone with a consistent experience. I have yet to see any argument how the App Store harms consumers. It helps developers make more money (Play Store revenue is half that of the App store's…

Um, the harm is 30% more expensive apps. If devs can't avoid the cut, its only going to get passed down to the user.

Except in the real world when we see games offered in multiple places (e.g. Steam and the Epic Game Store) they are usually the same price.

In other words, any savings from the developer cut is simply kept by the developer, not passed onto the consumer.

Re: Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint

#624

Post by Zash »

jrockway wrote: post #614
dubcanada wrote: post #184

I can hardly wait to use Amazon App Store to install Amazon and then open up the Epic Game Store to install random game and then open up EA Game Store to install random game and then open up Facebook App Store to install Facebook and then open up the Apple App Store to install the Blizzard App Store to install Hearthstone and then go back to the Apple App Store and update the Blizzard App Store so I can get the lates…

It is annoying how every PC game company tries to be a social network and persistent advertising daemon. But a launcher is not necessary to keep an app updated. Look at Chrome -- you install it, and it stays up to date. Blizzard could do that for their games and Epic could do that for their games, but they want extra money from putting ads in a launcher. (Actually, they seem to always be "house ads", so they aren't r…

Aside: Epic Games already uses XMPP according to https://www.epicgames.com/fortnite/en-US/news/postmortem-of-...

Re: Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint

#625

Post by mywittyname »

IntelMiner wrote: post #100
mywittyname wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MS is ahead of the curve here. Rather than trying to combat homebrew, they are embracing it within some predefined boundaries. The 360 allowed for homebrew as well. I think they learned a lot from XBMC.

What? The 360 never had any homebrew enabled

Sure you could! I used XNA Game Studio to produce games and apps that would run on my 360. They couldn't take full advantage of the hardware. But if you paid a fee, you could sell your game on XBL much like the App Store or Steam.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_XNA_Game_Studio

Re: Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint

#626

Post by mitchdaily »

ballenf wrote: post #616
015a wrote: post #497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As opposed to Developers not having the choice to distribute their own app stores? There is no solution to this problem that benefits everyone perfectly. There are only solutions which are better than the solution we have today. Actually, there is one near-perfect solution; Apple reduces their cut to ~5% and stops enforcing their insane rules. But that's not happening. You, and many others in this thread, are blaming…

As a developer I just don’t like the precedent that if I’m too successful at creating a great product that I therefore lose control over the very qualities of my product that made it successful.

This applies to everything though. If I drill of oil and am 'too successful' and abuse my position the Gov cracks down on me. Same if a telco is 'too successful'

And you are forgetting that 'too successful' in these cases is: literally has billions in profit uses market position in an anti competitive way

Re: Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint

#627

Post by t-writescode »

dkonofalski wrote: post #303
sheepdestroyer wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

App store are good, not argument. The inability of side loading beside the store is what is being critisized.

That's literally a major reason why people buy Apple products, though. If you can't sideload things, there's literally no chance of your phone being compromised by those things.

When the next Matrix or whatever service gets taken off the app store for hate speech on decentralized servers, I'll be grateful for a way to sideload if this goes through.

As it is, I have to trust Apple to "not be evil", something Google certainly failed at.

Re: Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint

#628

Post by simion314 »

Notorious_BLT wrote: post #517
simion314 wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will disagree, you can see the entitlement of users that demand the game,movie or payment system must be exactly his preferred one. Though for Valve you can compete with them (but people hate it but I think they don't hate the actual competition but the shitty implementation of the stores and the fact this game launcher most of the time must be run in background ) BUT with Apple you can't compete, they have up to 5…

It isn't entitlement for consumers to look at a company saying "you can buy this game, but only on our own launcher/storefront" and say "okay, then I won't buy it". Users don't like juggling Steam, Origin, Uplay, Epic, and whatever other launchers/storefronts. If publishers feel the additional sales are important, they can make it available through Steam.

I don't think there is any sane user that will say something as stupid like "I wish Cool Game 3 would be only on Origin(or only on Steam). So we should try to get most games on all stores not try to get them only on our facorite store.

The issue with the launchers is indeed a problem, the solution is to have the games run without the shitty launcher. So if you want to buy and play a game you can open your browser, find the best deal, buy the game and if you want do a direct download and play, or use a launcher, install the game then kill the launcher and play the game. This is the GOG model, you don't need the launcher.

So IMO the launcher issue should be addressed by fixing it, not by praying that there will be no competition in future so only my favorite launcher will exist.

Re: Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint

#629

Post by rodgerd »

015a wrote: post #497
BrianGragg wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is the choice is taken away from you though. Just like he said with the game market. If you want to play Game A, you go and download/install Game A's publishing app store. If you want to then play Game B, rinse and repeat. You will be forced to use so many different app stores and won't have a choice to NOT use their app store "IF" it progresses like it has on the desktop. No proof it will/won't either.

As opposed to Developers not having the choice to distribute their own app stores? There is no solution to this problem that benefits everyone perfectly. There are only solutions which are better than the solution we have today. Actually, there is one near-perfect solution; Apple reduces their cut to ~5% and stops enforcing their insane rules. But that's not happening. You, and many others in this thread, are blaming…

Apple make their devices for their customers. I don't really give a fuck about what toxic crap developers want to be able to get away with.

Re: Epic Games steps up Apple fight with EU antitrust complaint

#630

Post by simion314 »

valparaiso wrote: post #609
simion314 wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This sucks, but who is guilt for this, the giant publishers, why? because AppStores have a big tax , so competition that would lower the tax would solve the problem, Is same with video streaming, the giants don't want other giants to get a big cut without working hard. IMO , AppStore competition should be like web hosting, competition is large enough so you have enough choice to buy exactly what you want. Imagine if…

30% is one of the lowest fees in the market. Amazon's Twitch takes 50% fee. Also Tencent, who is behind Epic Games lawsuit takes 50% fee in China with their Android App Store.

So? on MacBooks you can download and install any applications, including GPL ones for free, no censorship or GPL aversion issues. Because inn your opinion Apple shit stinks less still you should have the freedom to not eat it. so you should have the choice not to use the store
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