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Mining Bitcoin with pencil and paper: 0.67 hashes per day (2014)

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Re: Mining Bitcoin with pencil and paper: 0.67 hashes per day (2014)

#71
post #30

When doing it manually can people find shortcuts that would elude brute force computation?

AFAIK hashing algorithms are specifically designed so that you can't take shortcuts. That said, there was a technique that allowed you do do just that[1], but it has been patched.

[1] https://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/1604/1604.00575.pdf

Re: Mining Bitcoin with pencil and paper: 0.67 hashes per day (2014)

#72

The fact that bitcoin mining on its own is now consuming as much electricity as the country of Argentina with no end in sight, as we are accelerating toward a climate change cliff, is sickening. Given this fact alone it's hard to see cryptocurrency as anything but a selfish crackpot scheme to generate a few dollars at the expense of humanity and our planet.

How much energy is consumed by online banking? Big Tech in general? These are sincere questions.

Re: Mining Bitcoin with pencil and paper: 0.67 hashes per day (2014)

#73

The fact that bitcoin mining on its own is now consuming as much electricity as the country of Argentina with no end in sight, as we are accelerating toward a climate change cliff, is sickening. Given this fact alone it's hard to see cryptocurrency as anything but a selfish crackpot scheme to generate a few dollars at the expense of humanity and our planet.

To give you the other side: It also uses less than all idle devices plugged in, in the US. Either Argentina doesnt use as much as you’d think or the US wastes a whole lot of power doing nothing. I’d argue thats way worse than mining bitcoin!

Anyway its a sensationalist statistic designed to arouse your response. I’d expect theres heaps of things more wasteful.. office building services running 24/7 comes to mind

Re: Mining Bitcoin with pencil and paper: 0.67 hashes per day (2014)

#74
post #37
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t that kind of what you are doing by posting that comment? You could respond and explain why you disagree - instead you just shallowly dismissed their comment by saying it was shallow. Also maybe I’m crazy but their comment seemed to be a joke/commentary on the environmental resources used by Bitcoin. That isn’t a shallow dismissal.

It's a shallow joke. One of the rules of HN is to attempt to have thoughtful and substantive discussions. An entire comment that is just a joke is not how you end up with substantive discussion, which I think has been well proven by reddit long since. It's fine to have a joke to lead into a well articulated point, but an entire comment shouldn't _just_ be a joke, unless it's the rare case of a joke that is insightful…

It really wasn’t ‘just a joke’ though. There is a whole range of discussion to be had on the resources used by crypto - and if you can make a quip and also commentary I see that as valuable. Is it the pinnacle of HN comments? Not at all. But does it deserve to be moderated? Not in my book because it does bring up a valuable point of discussion.

Re: Mining Bitcoin with pencil and paper: 0.67 hashes per day (2014)

#75
post #63

The fact that bitcoin mining on its own is now consuming as much electricity as the country of Argentina with no end in sight, as we are accelerating toward a climate change cliff, is sickening. Given this fact alone it's hard to see cryptocurrency as anything but a selfish crackpot scheme to generate a few dollars at the expense of humanity and our planet.

Why is the idea of people using electricity to make money so sickening?

That’s the question that I never see answered. Presumably if someone is using electricity to mine bitcoins, it’s because they couldn’t use that electricity for something more valuable (including things this commenter would probably consider more wholesome? or “valuable to society”?) like producing food.

Re: Mining Bitcoin with pencil and paper: 0.67 hashes per day (2014)

#76

You spent two days generating a hash? What a waste of resources. EDIT: harsh crowd today. I could care less how the author spends their time. Am I the only one that saw all the articles talking about how bad BTC is for the environment recently?

> You spent two days generating a hash? What a waste of resources.

It's for entertainment, and it looks like OP learned something. It's better use of resources than staring at a TV all day, which presumably you won't have an issue with.

>Am I the only one that saw all the articles talking about how bad BTC is for the environment recently?

At this point it's beating a dead horse.

Re: Mining Bitcoin with pencil and paper: 0.67 hashes per day (2014)

#77
post #73

The fact that bitcoin mining on its own is now consuming as much electricity as the country of Argentina with no end in sight, as we are accelerating toward a climate change cliff, is sickening. Given this fact alone it's hard to see cryptocurrency as anything but a selfish crackpot scheme to generate a few dollars at the expense of humanity and our planet.

To give you the other side: It also uses less than all idle devices plugged in, in the US. Either Argentina doesnt use as much as you’d think or the US wastes a whole lot of power doing nothing. I’d argue thats way worse than mining bitcoin! Anyway its a sensationalist statistic designed to arouse your response. I’d expect theres heaps of things more wasteful.. office building services running 24/7 comes to mind

Yeah, but the rest of us don't have to put up with legions of people excitedly explaining about how idle devices are great and everyone else should idle more devices.

Bitcoin consuming massive amounts of electricity is bad. Idle devices consuming massive amounts of electricity is also bad.

Re: Mining Bitcoin with pencil and paper: 0.67 hashes per day (2014)

#78

The fact that bitcoin mining on its own is now consuming as much electricity as the country of Argentina with no end in sight, as we are accelerating toward a climate change cliff, is sickening. Given this fact alone it's hard to see cryptocurrency as anything but a selfish crackpot scheme to generate a few dollars at the expense of humanity and our planet.

Maybe we should blame the defenders of constant inflation and government overreach. You mentioned Argentina, which is a prime example of these problems. If we didn't have those problems in the first place, Bitcoin wouldn't be as attractive.

What % of bitcoin owners own it for political reasons along your lines, compared to people just using it as an investment?

Re: Mining Bitcoin with pencil and paper: 0.67 hashes per day (2014)

#79
post #63

The fact that bitcoin mining on its own is now consuming as much electricity as the country of Argentina with no end in sight, as we are accelerating toward a climate change cliff, is sickening. Given this fact alone it's hard to see cryptocurrency as anything but a selfish crackpot scheme to generate a few dollars at the expense of humanity and our planet.

Why is the idea of people using electricity to make money so sickening?

Because money is a collective fiction we can easily "make" using only ideas, while electricity is a real and finite resource, the safe and sustainable generation of which is a primary concern for our future. It feels like a bad trade.

Re: Mining Bitcoin with pencil and paper: 0.67 hashes per day (2014)

#80
post #77
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To give you the other side: It also uses less than all idle devices plugged in, in the US. Either Argentina doesnt use as much as you’d think or the US wastes a whole lot of power doing nothing. I’d argue thats way worse than mining bitcoin! Anyway its a sensationalist statistic designed to arouse your response. I’d expect theres heaps of things more wasteful.. office building services running 24/7 comes to mind

Yeah, but the rest of us don't have to put up with legions of people excitedly explaining about how idle devices are great and everyone else should idle more devices. Bitcoin consuming massive amounts of electricity is bad. Idle devices consuming massive amounts of electricity is also bad.

GP claimed that generating dollars using electricity is bad. Isn't that what the majority of companies are doing?

Edit: that's my whole point: mining BTC is generating value by verifying transactions. In turn, the miner gets paid for their work.

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