What does ESG stand for? I searched the article and it’s not there. I’m sure it’s widely known in the literature this writes into, but key terms should still be introduced along with the acronym.
Environmental, Social, and Corporate Governance.
Bitcoin and other PoW coins are an ESG nightmare
41–50 of 242 posts
Re: Bitcoin and other PoW coins are an ESG nightmare
#42So since bitcoin is up right now, we're just going to see nonstop attacks on the fact that it's not climate friendly with its energy usage? Feels like this is the sixth article I've seen on Hacker News in the last month. From a quick skim this article seems like it might have some good data, but it also has a bunch of loaded language in it that turns me off from wanting to read the article. "Bitcoin and other PoW coi…
Hacker News is indeed being overrun by a too large amount of irrational bitcoin FUD.
The energy 'argument' is easily debunked. But that's not what this comment is about, so I won't rehash it here.
Trying to change people's minds on here doesn't work. But you know what? That's okay!
It signals us bitcoin holders how incredibly early we are in this life changing monetary revolution, that we are seeing unfold before our very eyes.
Bitcoin was meant to be attacked from all angles, non stop. It's what makes it so resilient.
If it can fail, it must fail.
But it's not failing, is it?
Quite the opposite...
Every bitcoin newcomer who reads this FUD, is going to remember it years from now, when bitcoin is still around and at higher prices than ever.
And they'll think to themselves... "Well, if after all these years, bitcoin is still around, despite supposedly being a bad thing, then it might not be such a bad thing after all!".
So I say:
Let they naysayers attempt to take bitcoin down. It will only result in new all time highs for my portfolio. And for that, I am grateful.
The early bird gets the worm. The late ones convince themselves the worms are poisonous, leaving more worms for the early birds.
Nature takes its course.
Re: Bitcoin and other PoW coins are an ESG nightmare
#43Bitcoin critics continue to assert that mining is wasteful and disproportionately damaging to the environment.
Contrary to consensus thinking, we believe the impact of bitcoin mining is a net positive for the environment.
Here's why: First, proof-of-work mining is critical to Bitcoin. In the Bitcoin network, trustworthiness is protected by computation, and mining is what gives Bitcoin its ability to coordinate trust and facilitate the transfer of value without relying on a centralized authority. The costliness to produce bitcoin is fundamental to its value.
Unlike the US dollar, Bitcoin cannot be printed with the stroke of a keyboard.
Instead, it converts the output from cheap stranded energy sources into something with monetary value. Even so, Bitcoin’s energy consumption is trivial compared to legacy financial systems. As measured by electricity costs alone, Bitcoin is much more efficient than traditional banking and gold mining on a global scale. Traditional banking consumes 2.34 B GJ/yr and gold mining 500 M GJ/yr, while Bitcoin consumes 184 M GJ/yr.
Additionally, Bitcoin mining’s estimated $ cost / GJ expended is 40x more efficient than that of traditional banking and 10x more efficient than that of gold mining. Another common mistake energy detractors make is to naively extrapolate Bitcoin’s energy consumption to the equivalent CO2 emissions. What matters is the type of energy source being used to generate electricity. In reality, renewables account for the largest percentage of bitcoin’s energy mix. In the search for the cheapest form of electricity, miners flock to regions offering a glut of renewable electricity, unlocking stranded energy assets.In some instances, Bitcoin mining is even helping to reduce greenhouse gas emissions by consuming methane that would have been leaked into the atmosphere via flaring."That energy would have been wasted, as is evidenced by the existence of flare stacks. That gas is flared because it can't be brought to market. Bitcoin miners are incentivized to show up and consume that wasted energy."Coins only need to be issued once. And it’s better for the planet that they be issued when the coin price was low, and the electricity expended to extract them was commensurately low.In summary, Bitcoin does not waste energy.
It is clear that because Bitcoin’s footprint is so easy to quantify, it is singled out for special treatment.
Re: Bitcoin and other PoW coins are an ESG nightmare
#44So since bitcoin is up right now, we're just going to see nonstop attacks on the fact that it's not climate friendly with its energy usage? Feels like this is the sixth article I've seen on Hacker News in the last month. From a quick skim this article seems like it might have some good data, but it also has a bunch of loaded language in it that turns me off from wanting to read the article. "Bitcoin and other PoW coi…
"Anarchic" is a perfectly reasonable, even necessary, descriptor for cryptocurrencies. They were born in the cypherpunk community, and Bitcoin cites Wei Dai's B-money, which directly namechecks Tim May's Crypto-anarchist manifesto.
Re: Bitcoin and other PoW coins are an ESG nightmare
#45I am so conflicted about the environmental impact of Proof-Of-Work. In many ways it feels like an arbitrary energy spend - but I think criticizing cryptocurrency for it seems a little disingenuous when we don't apply the same logic to other areas. What's the environmental impact of better refresh rates on monitors? What's the environmental impact of large scale cctv systems? What's the environmental impact of western…
What’s the environmental impact of Zoom running away with my CPU? What about Chrome?
I’ve finally accepted that I have to switch to Firefox because of Chrome’s performance problems. Apple and Intel and thermals are a know problem, but Chrome is awful too. There seems to be some sort of problematic interaction between MacOS, Chrome, and Google’s software updater that triggers runaway CPU usage. See:
https://mobile.twitter.com/lorenb/timelines/1338892756752732...
If there’s a flaw here that turns millions of computers into space heaters, what’s the impact?
Inefficiency is all around us. The Bitcoin inefficiency is by design and it’s a big part of why Bitcoin works. On the other hand, it feels like the paper clip game; eventually all matter in the universe will be converted into energy to mine Bitcoin.
Re: Bitcoin and other PoW coins are an ESG nightmare
#46So since bitcoin is up right now, we're just going to see nonstop attacks on the fact that it's not climate friendly with its energy usage? Feels like this is the sixth article I've seen on Hacker News in the last month. From a quick skim this article seems like it might have some good data, but it also has a bunch of loaded language in it that turns me off from wanting to read the article. "Bitcoin and other PoW coi…
Hacker News is indeed being overrun by a too large amount of irrational bitcoin FUD. The energy 'argument' is easily debunked. But that's not what this comment is about, so I won't rehash it here. Trying to change people's minds on here doesn't work. But you know what? That's okay! It signals us bitcoin holders how incredibly early we are in this life changing monetary revolution, that we are seeing unfold before our…
Ah I see https://www.amazon.com/Are-Missing-Real-Estate-Boom/dp/03855...
One can invest in Bitcoin if one wants, but only because The Market Can Remain Irrational Longer Than You Can Remain Solvent
Re: Bitcoin and other PoW coins are an ESG nightmare
#47What's the energy cost of a financial sector that takes a ~3% cut of all retail transactions, puts up physical bank branches to manage money, empowers a federal reserve to manage the value of currency with more or less competency... Comparing BTC energy costs to some mythical world where we just burn free lunches for heat is not honest.
Bitcoin is a tiny part of that world and simply becomes part of it.
Re: Bitcoin and other PoW coins are an ESG nightmare
#48So since bitcoin is up right now, we're just going to see nonstop attacks on the fact that it's not climate friendly with its energy usage? Feels like this is the sixth article I've seen on Hacker News in the last month. From a quick skim this article seems like it might have some good data, but it also has a bunch of loaded language in it that turns me off from wanting to read the article. "Bitcoin and other PoW coi…
But I have to trudge though your non-subtantive rant as the top comment. How about addressing the issue discussed in the posted article instead of opting out because you don’t like the language the author uses in an attempt (perhaps unskillful) at being persuasive?
Because I didn't read the full article yet, because it's super long and it's morning and I haven't had coffee and I'm getting ready for work.
I did read a little bit to see if it's worth reading later, and was really annoyed by its loaded language, and wanted to point it out to people who might not notice otherwise. Seems like, for the most part, at least right now, people agree with me.
Also I can't even go back to read it now if I wanted to, since it's now serving a 503 after being slammed with traffic, I assume.
Re: Bitcoin and other PoW coins are an ESG nightmare
#49I am so conflicted about the environmental impact of Proof-Of-Work. In many ways it feels like an arbitrary energy spend - but I think criticizing cryptocurrency for it seems a little disingenuous when we don't apply the same logic to other areas. What's the environmental impact of better refresh rates on monitors? What's the environmental impact of large scale cctv systems? What's the environmental impact of western…
Perhaps it's more reasonable to compare the energy footprint of cryptocurrency with that of our traditional fiat currencies. Including all computing power used by banks to settle their transactions.
Re: Bitcoin and other PoW coins are an ESG nightmare
#50Earlier quoted context omitted.
Hacker News is indeed being overrun by a too large amount of irrational bitcoin FUD. The energy 'argument' is easily debunked. But that's not what this comment is about, so I won't rehash it here. Trying to change people's minds on here doesn't work. But you know what? That's okay! It signals us bitcoin holders how incredibly early we are in this life changing monetary revolution, that we are seeing unfold before our…
Ah I see https://www.amazon.com/Are-Missing-Real-Estate-Boom/dp/03855... One can invest in Bitcoin if one wants, but only because The Market Can Remain Irrational Longer Than You Can Remain Solvent
Fiat is at the end of its lifespan. People are seeking refuge in bitcoin now. It's deflationary by design, which makes it an excellent store of value. It's value has only been going up for 12 years straight now. No bubble to be seen here.
The crypto market is now just gettings its first billionaires to invest in it (Michael Saylor, Elon Musk, GrayScale, etc.), and the market cap is still small. This is just getting started.