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Journalism, particularly at the highest level, is about raw power

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Re: Journalism, particularly at the highest level, is about raw power

#21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fact: You are conflating two separate instances where Trump bullied reporters to make your point. Instance from 2018 (with what you termed “racist” insinuations): https://youtu.be/OXp5GJjuOvQ Instance from 2020 actually relating to COVID-19: https://youtu.be/N5NQdmHzBTY I’m going to take this as a reminder that we should all carefully consider sources of information, even when those sources are our own recollections…

https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/covid-19-pandemic-us-preside... No, this was the "racist" incident when Weijia Jiang asked Trump why he was insisting on bringing up the fact that the U.S. was doing better than (several European countries, including UK, Italy, Spain, and France at the time) other countries. And he said, "They're losing their lives everywhere in the world. And maybe that's a question you should ask Chi…

She said: "Why does that matter? Why is this a global competition when, every day, Americans are still losing their lives?"

Did he answer the question? Or did he look at an Asian woman and immediately start attacking China?

And this is just ridiculous:

"Weirdly, some, who feared Trump being a true Hitler-like fascist 2-3 years ago, were upset that Trump wasn't being fascist enough and shutting the whole country down and overruling state governors on local policies."

There's nothing fascist about instituting a national healthcare policy during a national healthcare crisis. That's not what the word means. Fascism is far-right authoritarianism.

Marshalling private militias to attack people is fascism, however, and it's a practice Trump shares with both Hitler and Mussolini.

Re: Journalism, particularly at the highest level, is about raw power

#22
> why not Elon Musk's

Maybe because of the lies and fraud? Or the hazardous working conditions? Or all the people Tesla's lemons have killed when the wheels fell off or the "full self driving" system crashed the car at speed?

I don't believe that journalists are any better than the rest of us, but let's not pretend our "job creators" are good for the world.

Re: Journalism, particularly at the highest level, is about raw power

#23

The article describes what's wrong with media, unless I've blanked on some ripping satire. What serious journalist would ever let themselves be quoted lamenting, "The subjects are winning." It's like her extravagance knows no bounds or something. The headline occurs mid article and it's a good choice. When writing is about power, its job becomes to deliver narrative in that power struggle, and that means it's no long…

> Maybe if they were more interesting, more people would read them?

This is what caused the existing problem.

We had a media where people mostly believed them because they mostly cared about telling the truth, issued corrections when they were wrong, were critical of both political parties etc.

That media discovered that if they published outrage bait they got more clicks, because if something is outrageous and true then people are very interested. But things that are outrageous and true aren't all that common, so to keep the mill running they started publishing things that were outrageous and false.

That works until people figure out that they are no longer the media they were thought to be. Because things that are outrageous and false are boring. Anybody can write outrageous fiction. That's how we got into this. But the more readers who figure that out, the less credibility they have, and the less anybody wants to read their made up accounts.

Their existing solution seems to be to turn the dial up to eleven. So then everything is an existential threat and a hot war and literally Hitler. That whips up the frenzy for the people who still think what they're hearing bears some resemblance to the truth, but increases the number of people who realize it doesn't.

Eventually you get a critical mass of people no longer interested in hearing fantastical conspiracies about everything and somebody realizes there is a market for objective journalism and makes a name for themselves. Then, with any luck, the others follow. One can hope.

Re: Journalism, particularly at the highest level, is about raw power

#24
post #6

>> They felt that way because papers like the Post could offer the carrot of great exposure to those who needed it, but also, always, the stick of negative coverage to those who spurned them. There is nothing devious or ignoble about this; a powerful press, for all its flaws, is good for democracy No, doing hit pieces on anyone is a flagrant exercise of power that deserves no respect and destroys the credibility of t…

I'd suggest to read Hunter S. Thompson's obituary on Nixon https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/1994/07/he-was-... "It was all gibberish, of course. Nixon was no more a Saint than he was a Great President. He was more like Sammy Glick than Winston Churchill. He was a cheap crook and a merciless war criminal who bombed more people to death in Laos and Cambodia than the U.S. Army lost in all of World War II, an…

Nixon bombed more people to death in Laos and Cambodia than the U.S. Army lost in all of World War II.

Nixon connived to have Kent State students attacked and slain by the National Guard.

These are both facts that can easily be reported and are more than damning enough on their own without editorializing.

The editorializing actually makes the case weaker. It does a good job of riling up people who already agree with you, but to everyone else it just looks like you're biased and attacking someone because of a personal grudge.

Re: Journalism, particularly at the highest level, is about raw power

#25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/covid-19-pandemic-us-preside... No, this was the "racist" incident when Weijia Jiang asked Trump why he was insisting on bringing up the fact that the U.S. was doing better than (several European countries, including UK, Italy, Spain, and France at the time) other countries. And he said, "They're losing their lives everywhere in the world. And maybe that's a question you should ask Chi…

She said: "Why does that matter? Why is this a global competition when, every day, Americans are still losing their lives?" Did he answer the question? Or did he look at an Asian woman and immediately start attacking China? And this is just ridiculous: "Weirdly, some, who feared Trump being a true Hitler-like fascist 2-3 years ago, were upset that Trump wasn't being fascist enough and shutting the whole country down…

> There's nothing fascist about instituting a national healthcare policy during a national healthcare crisis. That's not what the word means. Fascism is far-right authoritarianism.

When the “national healthcare policy” you wanted him to institute is an authoritarian policy that overrules local governments and implements central economic planning, then yes, its fascism. Using different words to describe the same thing might work for the soundbite but people know the truth.

Re: Journalism, particularly at the highest level, is about raw power

#26

> why not Elon Musk's Maybe because of the lies and fraud? Or the hazardous working conditions? Or all the people Tesla's lemons have killed when the wheels fell off or the "full self driving" system crashed the car at speed? I don't believe that journalists are any better than the rest of us, but let's not pretend our "job creators" are good for the world.

I’ll take job creators over people who have money and do nothing with it.

There are affluent people who have money and park it or spend it away.

Also just having great volumes of potential workers and no one to organize them into a productive body does little good.

Re: Journalism, particularly at the highest level, is about raw power

#27
Start acting more like investigators of truth rather than as promoters of ideology, start acting more like free thinkers and less like thought police, start speaking truth to power more and being in bed with power less, and maybe more people will trust you.

Re: Journalism, particularly at the highest level, is about raw power

#28
post #16

>As journalists, we all view this as a horrifying assault on the public’s right to know, and on our own status as brave defenders of the public good. And that is all true, for what it’s worth. But this is about power. We need to take some back, lest the rich and powerful run away from one of the last forces restraining them. It's interesting that they seem to consider themselves the only ones with pure hearts. I'm no…

The scary part of journalism is when it’s about activism vs. the truth. Activists can lie if the truth isn’t important.

Lying for ratings, though, is also very bad.

Activists lying for both activist causes and ratings is extremely bad.

Re: Journalism, particularly at the highest level, is about raw power

#29
> As journalists, we all view this as a horrifying assault on the public’s right to know, and on our own status as brave defenders of the public good. And that is all true, for what it’s worth. But this is about power. We need to take some back, lest the rich and powerful run away from one of the last forces restraining them.

I don't want the same arrogant, self-unaware journalist that pushes pernicious narratives to the public and doxxes people for blogging to come and tell me how rich people are evil and their newspaper is a defender of the public good.

Just look in the mirror for a moment and realize that you are the problem.

Re: Journalism, particularly at the highest level, is about raw power

#30
Journalists were so desperate to take out Trump (and Republicans in general) that they torpedoed their own credibility.

4 years of non-stop "The world is ending" crises one right after another, with barely any time to realize that one amounted to nothing before the next one started has left people disillusioned. Add in the fact that when actual problems like Covid did occur, the press was slow to pick up on them. They wasted months mocking VC firms for not allowing handshakes instead of digging deeper into what they were talking about.

People will go listen to Elon Musk et al directly because they've learned that when they compare his actual words to journalists' interpretation of those words, they are completely different. If they stop lying people might start listening to them again.

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