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Armenia Is an Orphaned Client State

palladiummag.com

41–47 of 47 posts

Re: Armenia Is an Orphaned Client State

#41
post #40

> Armenia Is an Orphaned Client State Of course, it is. My answer below is an attempt to explain why it is an orphaned state. It has been so since its formation. During WWI, Armenian separatists in the Ottoman empire were tools used by Nicholas II to open an Eastern from to keep the Ottoman forces busy there so the British and their allies could take the straits and İstanbul and keep him in power. During the initial…

Yeah, I get the emotional downvotes, but a mention of what part of this (obviously broad-strokes) story is wrong would be appreciated.

Re: Armenia Is an Orphaned Client State

#42

Pity that this is also flagged, like most articles about the war (presumably by online mobs). It's an important conflict that the west should know about.

I read about half of article and facts were presented in naiive manner. From perspective of a person who only recently discovered everything that is going on. It looks disingenuous, and from that it is definitely propaganda.

While it is written from the armenian side, what does it propagandize? It expresses fear for a future war, how is that propaganda?

Re: Armenia Is an Orphaned Client State

#43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would require getting a handle on economics, corruption and political mismanagement. It would take a decade or more of change. They could align themselves more with the EU, but remember: The EU cannot, AND WILL NOT, go to war over a small asian country, regardless of how it align it self with the union. So Armenia would risk provoking it’s neighbors, with no way of defending it self. So, yeah, the EU would need…

Turkey is a small, weak country compared to the EU and was able to send significant help to Azerbaijan. It's not for the EU to be scared. They just need to setup camp in Armenia, then others will not dare attack. The problem is to indeed grow a pair and show some backbone instead of always being scared and weak. Again, the EU is (or can be) a massive power that others, including Russia, will not cross.

> It's not for the EU to be scared. They just need to setup camp in Armenia, then others will not dare attack.

That should be the case but is not: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre

Specifically, show me one country in the EU whose internal politics could sustain losing significant numbers of personnel in a proxy war with the second largest military in NATO.

Re: Armenia Is an Orphaned Client State

#44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would require getting a handle on economics, corruption and political mismanagement. It would take a decade or more of change. They could align themselves more with the EU, but remember: The EU cannot, AND WILL NOT, go to war over a small asian country, regardless of how it align it self with the union. So Armenia would risk provoking it’s neighbors, with no way of defending it self. So, yeah, the EU would need…

Turkey is a small, weak country compared to the EU and was able to send significant help to Azerbaijan. It's not for the EU to be scared. They just need to setup camp in Armenia, then others will not dare attack. The problem is to indeed grow a pair and show some backbone instead of always being scared and weak. Again, the EU is (or can be) a massive power that others, including Russia, will not cross.

The EU, it’s member countries and it general population have no grasp of the size, power and potential influence of the European Union and there’s almost zero interest in exploring it.

As a friend of mine suggested, one of the better routes the EU could take is to look to Switzerland and estabilish a confederation, with a single military, forereign policy and currency, but leave everything to the member states.

Re: Armenia Is an Orphaned Client State

#45
Armenians are a very enterprising, hard-working lot, I live in predominantly Armenian-American, Belmont Mass. and love them for their work-ethic and spirit.

I think Armenia's best bet for future is its brainpower - it should invest in education, technology and become an economic powerhouse - like a Taiwan or Singapore of the caucasus. I know it's easier said than done, but knowing the Armenian mind, it is feasible and perhaps its best bet given the complex geopolitics over there.

Re: Armenia Is an Orphaned Client State

#46
post #31

well, that's what being Russia's ally gets you.

Armenia had a pro-west government, but it received no support, the UN SC did not even issue any resolutions, and western media practically buried the news of the war because it happened during the US elections. The people of NK see the russians as guarantors of their safety (rightly so). Meanwhile a NATO country (Turkey) provided major support to AZ, including mercenaries from syria.

Yep. Russia is a shitty ally.

Re: Armenia Is an Orphaned Client State

#47

Seriously? A pro-armenian, propagandistic article in top of HN?

I mean, for those of us who aren't versed on the Armenian politics, would you care explaining what exactly makes it a propaganda article? To my untrained and unfamiliar with the region eye it just looks like reporting on the situation there, but I'd love to know more.

For all who asked to elaborate on my comment.

Disclaimer: I am Azeri and yes, I was triggered by the article. My judgement is indeed biased, but hopefully not that much. I've been living in Finland for 12 years now, and in the past studied with armenian students at the same class room. We had good relationships and deep conversations about how our region is cursed and the only way to survive - is to live together in peace.

Back to the article - an excellent piece of post-truth era text. It is filled with statements, juggled, shuffled and left incomplete, so that the reader has to fill the missing pieces. The missing information is brilliant in its absence. The resulting picture a reader sees is "Poor christian democratic ancient Armenia is surrounded by rich aggressive muslim dictatorship countries, and it is doomed.

I want to explain myself being triggered, literally from the top of this "article".

"The war was fought over the disputed mountainous region of Nagorno-Karabakh and several surrounding territories." OH REALLY? Somewhere at the bottom the article elaborates, that the "several surrounding territories" are 7 regions claimed by Armenia as "security belt". It never says though, that six hundred thousand (that is 600, 000!) souls from those regions have been displaced and were never able to return to their homes in all these 30 years. These have never been "disputed territories".

"...Karabakh is an internationally recognized territory of Azerbaijan, and Armenia is seen to have occupied the territory for over 30 years." - Except that Armenia has also *never* recognized the so-called "Republic of Artsakh" officially.

"...A smaller number of videos depicting Armenian war crimes also circle around Azerbaijan, but they pale in comparison in both quantity and ruthlessness to the Azerbaijani videos." - How about mentioning Armenian night-time ballistic missile attacks on the city of Ganja, which is located 50 km (30 mi) from the war zone? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_Ganja_missile_attacks "Private Telegram channel video" huh?

...who increasingly see each other’s annihilation as indispensable to their own survival. ...while Azerbaijan’s appetite for Armenian land seems boundless.

Somehow azeris and armenians are able to live in piece all around the world. In Russia, in Georgia, in Europe, in US. As long as they remember being human, not ape-alike, as long as their brain takes control of their instincts. Azerbaijan does not give a damn for Armenian land officially or unofficially. In this war, not a single Azeri stepped on Armenian land. Azerbaijan and its people want to be able to freely walk on their own lands.

This conflict could have been resolved a decade ago or even earlier. My only wish and hope that our people would stop fighting each other and start learning to live together.

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