81–90 of 180 posts
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2k8fHR9jKVM
I am not at all surprised that there are also olifactory illusions which are impossible to “unsee”.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think that raises questions about the quality of the wine more than about anything else. I'm more of a beer guy but I can easily tell white from red wine. Both taste and aftertaste are very different.
Scientists: We took a bunch of people who claim they can tell red wine from white wine based on taste, and successfully fooled most of them with food coloring. Internet commenter reading the study: I can definitely tell red wine from white wine based on taste.
Wine tasting is an art of deduction. The first step of any wine tasting is to look at the color, rim variation, legs, etc. From there, you take account the smell and taste. At a professional level, this is always done in a particular order to help narrow down possible characteristics for the next step. If you change the color of the wine, you'll send the wine taster down a completely different mental flow chart. The…
If you, as a wine taster, were asked to describe the taste of a mystery wine, I think it's somewhat disappointing if the color of the wine affects your perception.
Isn't taste supposed to be a first-order sensory experience?
I can't think of a more charitable interpretation of these results than "we have different vocabularies for red and white wines, even to describe the same tastes".
I used to make a living as a mastering engineer, where the job description is to make many tiny changes near or even beyond the threshold of perception, which when summed may add up to a perceptible whole. How to do this? It's simple: isolate and magnify. Zoom in to where your senses become reliable, make a change informed by your knowledge and experience which you predict will be beneficial, then zoom out. You don't…
To me red wine tastes very differently from white wine. Am I fooling myself? Are they really indistinguishable? Is it possible that the experts were afraid of using white attributes for a red wine, like in social consensus experiments? Did anybody ran a test in the dark, where you cant see the wine at all?
Obviously you can tell red wine from white. But if they color them wrong, you will trust your eyes mood then your taste.
Another somewhat famous study involved taking a cheap wine and an expensive wine and swapping the bottles. When people tasted the wines and the bottles were hidden, people accurately scored the wines. When the bottles were visible, people preferred the wine in the expensive bottle. All but the experts were susceptible to this effect.
>When people tasted the wines and the bottles were hidden, people accurately scored the wines. >All but the experts were susceptible to this effect. I dont understand If people managed to "accurately scored the wines", then what does "all but experts were suspectible" actually means?
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That's not what they are concluding. If they are tasting it blind (with no preconception), their taste is accurate. It becomes inaccurate when there is external bias (like cost or a particular label). Note that the actual article was based on the assessments of students. I wouldn't classify them as trained experts, as I'll detail below. I used to work in a brewery, and part of my job was beer tasting. We used the sam…
I want to push back on one of your central tenets. > f they are tasting it blind ... their taste is accurate It would be more accurate to say the tasting would be less subjective. I don’t think “accurate” is a good word - people all taste things differently due to different taste buds and psychological wirings. But even then, removing the label doesn’t mean people taste anything objectively. They are bringing in thei…
The latter is not subjective. The experience might be, the qualia might be, and it will change with training and priming, but the raw detection is what the parent is talking about and that is objective.
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I have witnessed with my own two eyes an experienced wine aficionado call the grape type, terroir (micro-region) and year of a brown-bagged wine, based on a single tasting. They were off by one year, but otherwise correct. There’s a ton of BS in the wine world, but it’s not all fake.
I have a few somm friends that can do this reliably. The process of elimination is really fascinating to watch. The reason it's possible, though, is because the majority of commercial wine conforms to distinct, repeatable styles. A grassy note in an amber-colored wine might narrow it down to a single grape variety, a hint of smoke might indicate the region. Then take the relative level of oxidation, and you've got a…
Wine tasting is an art of deduction. The first step of any wine tasting is to look at the color, rim variation, legs, etc. From there, you take account the smell and taste. At a professional level, this is always done in a particular order to help narrow down possible characteristics for the next step. If you change the color of the wine, you'll send the wine taster down a completely different mental flow chart. The…
If you were asked to identify a mystery wine, color would certainly be an important piece of information. If you, as a wine taster, were asked to describe the taste of a mystery wine, I think it's somewhat disappointing if the color of the wine affects your perception. Isn't taste supposed to be a first-order sensory experience? I can't think of a more charitable interpretation of these results than "we have differen…
To me red wine tastes very differently from white wine. Am I fooling myself? Are they really indistinguishable? Is it possible that the experts were afraid of using white attributes for a red wine, like in social consensus experiments? Did anybody ran a test in the dark, where you cant see the wine at all?
One way of subverting expectations is to try orange wine: white wine fermented with skins. Orange wine has tannins and can show some aspects you'd associate with a red, e.g. pepper. Yet it is still more on the citrus rather than berry end of the flavour spectrum.