Earlier quoted context omitted.
Your equation misses an 'efficiency' parameter.
Ah, yes, the fabled “efficiency” of private companies. Where would you have me put it? On teachers salaries? On building costs?
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The Shame of Swedish Education: J’Accuse
151–160 of 215 posts
Re: The Shame of Swedish Education: J’Accuse
#152Earlier quoted context omitted.
Swedish PISA results have fallen continuously in the past years. Last result showed a break from that but later it turned out that many students which could have been expected to test poorly were dissuaded from participating. So the result from that year is in question. There is huge concern in Sweden over the state of the schooling system. It is complex because so much have changed over the past 30 years. It is usua…
> Last result showed a break from that Correction: The last two results. > many students which could have been expected to test poorly were dissuaded from participating. So the result from that year is in question You mean newly arrived immigrants. They would greatly decrease the results depending on how many were excluded, yes, but PISA makes a distinction between immigrants and natives anyway so just look at the na…
I don't think that distinction is valuable. Immigrants that come to live here will need to be well equipped for adult life just like native Swedes are. That is why the downward trend has been so worrying. If the young generation in average has faired less well than previous generations, then that is worrying for our society.
Re: The Shame of Swedish Education: J’Accuse
#153Earlier quoted context omitted.
Neither. Parents don't pay for schools in Sweden, so profit driven schools are just as free as other schools. Also, they are not elite schools in any sense, they are just slightly better organised and attract students that care enough about their education to select a different school than the default. Sweden is not the US, it's quite different.
What you're saying, especially the part about "slightly better organised and attract students that care enough about their education" is talking point rhethoric and not anything substantiated in fact. The schools get a fixed amount of money per student from the state. If you have students with high socio-economic status, you can get away with having fewer teachers per student, as well has having teachers that aren't…
In the Swedish system, all schools cost the same: 0. So there is no reason to target specifically wealthy students, all students are worth the same to you as school owner.
In fact, they can't even accept students based on grades, there are only 4 criteria they are allowed to use when selecting students: location, time in queue, siblings in the school and whether you went to pre-school there.
So what you end up with are students with parents that have enough forethought to put your name down early on.
> You can't "optimize" what's essentially a service institution.
I'm not sure what you mean by this, obviously you could in theory most definitely optimise the education. That is what private schools here in Denmark tend to do.
Re: The Shame of Swedish Education: J’Accuse
#154Earlier quoted context omitted.
Swedish schools always have school cafeterias, free of charge, it's only in very rare situations like here that this is not the case.
I was specifically suggesting for the non cafeteria ones that the the parent comment from a current student. Not to replace existing programs. I went to a private school. Public schools had free schools lunches in India too. But even then if parents could afford it, they always sent home cooked packed lunches. Because the population is so culturally and linguistically diverse, there were as many types of regional cui…
> I was specifically suggesting for the non cafeteria ones that the the parent comment from a current student
And I'm saying that this category of school essentially doesn't exist. It's not that most schools have cafeterias. All schools do, except for a handful.
Re: The Shame of Swedish Education: J’Accuse
#155Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, eating McD on a daily basis is not only boring but downright unhealthy. I remember eating at McD when in college because it was perceivably cheaper and while I was enjoying the food when I was hungry I always felt not so good afterwards. I haven’t touched any MCD in 10 years and won’t do anytime soon unless there’s an emergency
I find it weird that we have fast food restaurants on the list too. Even weirder is that they compensate with "healthier" restaurants that are so far away we don't have time to get there.
I don't think its weird. Its just a function of supply and demand : vendors following the customers, not the other way around.
In the US, Customers are college students, and they don't have money for restaurants. That's why you have pizza joints near campuses, and not healthy options instead. I suspect this is more of the same here.
Re: The Shame of Swedish Education: J’Accuse
#156Earlier quoted context omitted.
Profit-driven schools don't cater to gifted kids. They cater to kids with rich and highly educated parents. The goal is to do less, to extract more profit.
Neither. Parents don't pay for schools in Sweden, so profit driven schools are just as free as other schools. Also, they are not elite schools in any sense, they are just slightly better organised and attract students that care enough about their education to select a different school than the default. Sweden is not the US, it's quite different.
Now go and have a look where the schools are located. For-profit schools are more often located in areas where education level is higher. Less money spent on educating kids means more profit ina system where each student gets a fixed amount.
Re: The Shame of Swedish Education: J’Accuse
#157I'm a student in one of the AcadeMedia for-profit schools. They have around 30 schools with the same brand name as mine and they keep on buying others. There's over 600 of them. There are of course other brands that they own but this one is focused on technology. Now let me tell you about my experience. First, this school is very focused on marketing. They keep on doing things that are only for seemingly attracting s…
Is bringing a lunch you make at home an option? You might even be able to save up some money that way.
Only on the summer as the school does not allow eating anything other than what the cafeteria serves in the buildings. The lunch cards are restricted to certain restaurants only.
Re: The Shame of Swedish Education: J’Accuse
#158Earlier quoted context omitted.
Neither. Parents don't pay for schools in Sweden, so profit driven schools are just as free as other schools. Also, they are not elite schools in any sense, they are just slightly better organised and attract students that care enough about their education to select a different school than the default. Sweden is not the US, it's quite different.
Now go and have a look where the schools are located. For-profit schools are more often located in areas where education level is higher. Less money spent on educating kids means more profit ina system where each student gets a fixed amount.
I'm not sure what your point is. Putting a school in a middle class area rather than a ghetto doesn't make it "elite". Especially when any kid can go there, regardless of where they live.
Re: The Shame of Swedish Education: J’Accuse
#159Earlier quoted context omitted.
What you're saying, especially the part about "slightly better organised and attract students that care enough about their education" is talking point rhethoric and not anything substantiated in fact. The schools get a fixed amount of money per student from the state. If you have students with high socio-economic status, you can get away with having fewer teachers per student, as well has having teachers that aren't…
In the Swedish system, all schools cost the same: 0. So there is no reason to target specifically wealthy students, all students are worth the same to you as school owner. In fact, they can't even accept students based on grades, there are only 4 criteria they are allowed to use when selecting students: location, time in queue, siblings in the school and whether you went to pre-school there. So what you end up with a…
Yes, but no:
- The schools get a fixed amount of money per student.
- The single largest predictor of school success is education level of the parents.
- most for profit schools are in areas with higher education.
Re: The Shame of Swedish Education: J’Accuse
#160> With the deregulation of the 1990s, the ambition was to create thriving, independent schools, foundations, parent cooperatives and small limited company schools with educational alternatives. Sure, and the purpose of privatising welfare institutions, railroads and electric grids is to benefit the citizens, not the cronies of politicians...
That's not the problem. The problem is having government partially funding private companies. Let the parents pay for private schools and the market will select schools that do the best compromise for their need. I've found some unverified results claiming that parents are more satisfied with Swedish independent school than public schools. If that's true, parents are still getting a better service than with the publi…
> I'm pro privatisation in general because, in my experience, government-run institutions waste more money and provide a worse service.
Of course that is generally true, but some things are natural monopolies. For example the railroads. If there is no effective competition, private companies have no real incentive to improve service, but they do have an incentive to lower their costs, often leading to worse service.