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MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

reuters.com

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Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#111

Post by hanniabu »

liquidify wrote: post #27
sschueller wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is outright scam in my view. They never have to hold bitcoin. They may as well sell paypal coin. Robinhood and Revolut do the same thing. If you can't transfer out your bitcoin, you don't have any bitcoin.

They couldn't do that. If they didn't actually have any crypto, in the event of a large scale increase in price combined with a large scale cash out, Paypal would have to eat the difference from buy to sell price. They would lose their shirt. At minimum, Paypal is buying some percentage of the crypto sales in actual crypto to act as a hedge. However, it is more likely they are closer to 1 to 1 backing since they prob…

> Paypal would have to eat the difference from buy to sell price.

Why? If they never offer withdrawals then they don't need to worry about that.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#112

Post by EGreg »

olalonde wrote: post #88
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #2

These stories usually spur more enthusiasm for buying cryptocurrency, but ironically those buyers aren’t interested in spending cryptocurrency using their MasterCard. They’re hoping other people will buy cryptocurrency from these announcements, driving the price up. Or, more likely, they’re just hoping other people will buy cryptocurrency and not use it in these spending systems. Spending cryptocurrency would result…

Bitcoin is used as a speculative investment today only because it is so underpriced. Once its value stabilizes, its use in day to day transactions will grow. > Should also note that MasterCard crypto transactions almost certainly won’t be settled on the blockchain. And neither are USD transactions. In fact, USD doesn't even have a blockchain! The great thing with Bitcoin is once you want to cash out your Bitcoin, you…

False. It will never be a mainstream medium of exchange because its block size can only handle 10 transactions per second.

It will be a reserve asset, used to back actual payment systems.

And eventually other newer technologies will supplant it, as long as there are “synthetic bitcoins” that can be on that new network, crypto collateralized.

If that new network launches as a sidechain though, then free unstaked BTC will be a perpetually dwindling amount of coins, and perpetually going up in price like collectibles or gold. With no other thing giving them value other than everyone else wanting it, and the miners / HODLers shilling it. It is a perfect investmen vehicle, it can go to $50 Billion a free coin once most coins are staked in other things. So, ironically, competitors better in every way will drive up the price for those who don’t switch and keeo HODLing for decades. And mining rewards will be worth so much that electricity will be wasted on a bigger and bigger scale until people can’t afford to power their homes since bitcoin mining makes more $. It’s sad... but where is the flaw in the logic

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#113

Post by maeln »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #12
sschueller wrote: post #5

I don't want mastercard supporting crypto. I want the merchants and payment providers supporting crypto so I do not have to use mastercard and their "rules". If I want to pay for porn or send a donation to wikileaks I do not want mastercard/paypal or anyone else other than the government (if it's legal I should be allowed to pay for it) deciding if that is ok.

Bitcoin transaction fees are currently around $8. My credit card pays me 2% to use it. No one wants to use the Bitcoin blockchain for average transactions. No one is buying Bitcoin as anything other than a speculative investment right now.

And let's not forget that bitcoin can process on average less than 7 transactions per seconds. That's incredibly slow. It can be used for anything irl as long as this fundamental problem is not fixed. Nobody will spend 10+ minutes in front of the cashier waiting for the transaction to be confirmed.

Most cryptocurrencies are plagued by the same issue. Everyone and their mother still come out with their own cryptocurrencies, but none has been proven to have any actual usefulness outside of speculation. I guess Monero and ZCash are at least really used as a transaction method because of the "black market", but, outside of anonymity, they also have the same fundamental issue that btc has.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#114

Post by kungito »

systemvoltage wrote: post #84
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #2

These stories usually spur more enthusiasm for buying cryptocurrency, but ironically those buyers aren’t interested in spending cryptocurrency using their MasterCard. They’re hoping other people will buy cryptocurrency from these announcements, driving the price up. Or, more likely, they’re just hoping other people will buy cryptocurrency and not use it in these spending systems. Spending cryptocurrency would result…

What's the point of an unstable, volatile, frantically manipulated currency that is susceptible to social media pump and dump schemes (Elon + Doge)? Currency and its exchange rate needs to be relatively stable for the world to put trust into it. Saying that BTC is stable, but the rest of the world's fiat currency is fluctuating makes no sense. US dollar provides stability and security, I feel confident that a cappucc…

But did you ever wonder where the stability of USD comes from? It all comes down to how big the transaction volume of your currency is. Things like "Petrodollar" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petrodollar_recycling#Petrodol... increase the volume and provide additional stability. As "market cap" of bitcoin increases, so does the stability. All things considered, bitcoin still is very bad because of the transaction throughput which still remains an unsolved problem. I don't see how arbitrage can happen on the price if the transactions are so expensive. I guess BTC will end up living in the various exchange siloses

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#115

Post by eswat »

GekkePrutser wrote: post #68
ArtTimeInvestor wrote: post #4

The game Paypal currently plays with Crypto is the closest thing to printing money I have ever seen: Their users can "buy and sell Bitcoin" and pay "no fees". How does Paypal make money? "From the spread". The difference between bid and ask. And who sets the spread? Drumroll ... Paypal! Since you cannot transfer your bitcoins out, when you sell your bitcoins, Paypal pays you whatever they like. So far, Paypal only of…

Lol.. You can't transfer them out?? What's the point of buying them then? Sounds more like a lease thing.

Pretty much. Many want exposure to the price appreciation without having to deal with minutae like custody.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#116

Post by janoside »

systemvoltage wrote: post #84
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #2

These stories usually spur more enthusiasm for buying cryptocurrency, but ironically those buyers aren’t interested in spending cryptocurrency using their MasterCard. They’re hoping other people will buy cryptocurrency from these announcements, driving the price up. Or, more likely, they’re just hoping other people will buy cryptocurrency and not use it in these spending systems. Spending cryptocurrency would result…

What's the point of an unstable, volatile, frantically manipulated currency that is susceptible to social media pump and dump schemes (Elon + Doge)? Currency and its exchange rate needs to be relatively stable for the world to put trust into it. Saying that BTC is stable, but the rest of the world's fiat currency is fluctuating makes no sense. US dollar provides stability and security, I feel confident that a cappucc…

What's the point, you ask...

Here is Ross Stevens, CEO of Stone Ridge Asset Management, describing "the point" for an hour:

https://www.microstrategy.com/en/bitcoin/videos/bitcoin-macr...

It sounds like you've made up your mind about Bitcoin, but I believe you've missed the big picture. The above video, if you watch it with an open mind, will help you to glimpse it. Hint: it's not about cappuccino, it's about living in a world of competitively devaluing currencies and resulting asset inflation.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#117

Post by ahnick »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #25
vortico wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin is only good for large transactions, but there are 1000000 cryptocurrencies that solve this problem such as BCH, USDT, and LTC. Use one of them.

Honestly, why? My credit card pays me 2% to use it. If there’s a problem with my transaction, I click some buttons and the card company reversed the charges. If I lose my card, I call them up and get another one overnight without losing all my money. Why would I give all of that up, pay exchange fees on both ends of a transaction, pay transaction fees (however small), and wait longer for my transactions to clear?

Most people can't put >$20,000 on their credit card and large money transfers over traditional financial institutions (wires/ACH) at best take many hours or days.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#118

Post by whatshisface »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #82
whatshisface wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Spending cryptocurrency would result in selling that cryptocurrency, which would drive the price down. That’s not what cryptocurrency investors actually want. That's a misunderstanding of how these things work. If selling drove the price down, then the price would never go up! Why? Because nobody can buy without a sale on the other side of the transaction. The common belief that selling lowers the price comes from…

A system for spending Bitcoin would inherently put sell orders in at market price (directly or indirectly). This consumes the highest priced bids and moves the price down. It’s the same story with any currency. Basic foreign exchange concepts.

Smart sellers don't sell everything at the market price as soon as they can, because that would cut through the crust of fair asks into the mantle of waiting opportunists. Instead they spread it out, at a rate the ongoing volume can bear.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#119

Post by throwaway1777 »

PretzelPirate wrote: post #49
ValentineC wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I’d prefer if it wasn’t MasterCard since I use Visa cards, but I can’t complain too much. I'm curious: is this because your preferred bank mainly issues Visa cards, or are there things about MasterCard that you don't like?

My bank mainly issues Visa cards. I’ve had multiple cards throughout my life, and I’ve never had a master card before. I’d like to just add this feature to my existing cards that I already have set up for payments. Completely off topic: What I really want in life is: 1. If I could have a virtual credit card that could act as a proxy card and would let me use different cards based on the items I was purchasing (ex: if…

Settle down and have kids. Your problems will be solved.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#120

Post by X6S1x6Okd1st »

systemvoltage wrote: post #84
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #2

These stories usually spur more enthusiasm for buying cryptocurrency, but ironically those buyers aren’t interested in spending cryptocurrency using their MasterCard. They’re hoping other people will buy cryptocurrency from these announcements, driving the price up. Or, more likely, they’re just hoping other people will buy cryptocurrency and not use it in these spending systems. Spending cryptocurrency would result…

What's the point of an unstable, volatile, frantically manipulated currency that is susceptible to social media pump and dump schemes (Elon + Doge)? Currency and its exchange rate needs to be relatively stable for the world to put trust into it. Saying that BTC is stable, but the rest of the world's fiat currency is fluctuating makes no sense. US dollar provides stability and security, I feel confident that a cappucc…

It's kind of moot w.r.t. MasterCard. They will only accept stablecoins which are generally pegged to usd
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